How long does our Democracy have?

[DrHolliday]

Got this recycled email (funny how these emails come back every few years). Anyway, the point of the email remains the same. However, it looks like now we are in stage 7 (From apathy to dependence) when you consider all the darn bail outs.

>
>How Long Do We Have?
>
>About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution
>in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the
>University of Edinburgh, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian
>Republic some 2,000 years earlier:
>
>'A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as
>a permanent form of government.'
>
>'A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that
>voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the
>public treasury.'
>
>'From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates
>who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the
>result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal
>policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship.'
>
>'The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the
>beginning of history, has been about 200 years'
>
>'During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through
>the following sequence:
>
>1.
>From bondage to spiritual faith;
>
>
>2.
>From spiritual faith to great
>courage;
>
>
>3.
>From courage to liberty;
>
>
>4.
>From liberty to abundance;
>
>
>5.
>From abundance to complacency;
>
>
>6.
>From complacency to apathy;
>
>
>7.
>From apathy to dependence;
>
>
>8.
>From dependence back into bondage'
>
>
>
>Professor Joseph Olson of Hemline University School of Law, St. Paul ,
>Minnesota , points out some interesting facts concerning the 2000
>Presidential election:
>
>Number of States won by: Democrats: 19 Republicans: 29
>
>Square miles of land won by: Democrats: 580,000 Republicans: 2,427,000
>
>Population of counties won by: Democrats: 127 million Republicans: 143
>million
>
>Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by: Democrats: 13.2
>Republicans: 2.1
>
>Professor Olson adds: 'In aggregate, the map of the territory Republican
>won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this
>great country. Democrat territory mostly encompassed those
>citizens living in government-owned tenements and living off various forms
>of government welfare...' Olson believes the United States is now
>somewhere between the 'complacency and apathy' phase of Professor
>Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's
>population already having reached the 'governmental dependency'
>phase.
>

[anothersta]

Look at that map as if you just arrived here from Mars.

http://images.newsmax.com/misc/2008_Election_Map.jpg

[Bahet]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

[DrHolliday]

Look at that map as if you just arrived here from Mars.

http://images.newsmax.com/misc/2008_Election_Map.jpg

All I can say is, "God bless Oklahoma!" Not a single county in that state went to Obama. :smokin:

[Jolie Rouge]

Look at that map as if you just arrived here from Mars.

http://images.newsmax.com/misc/2008_Election_Map.jpg

http://images.newsmax.com/misc/2008_Election_Map.jpg

[Jolie Rouge]

What do the "white" spaces represent ??

[DrHolliday]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

You do know that snopes is primarily comprised of twenty year old kids that are predominantly Obama supporters, don't you?

Regardless of whether or not Olsen made those remarks he was credited with, Alexander Tyler clearly wrote about how a democracy declines. And we are clearly at stage 7 as shown by everyone and their brother crying for a bailout. :slap

[DrHolliday]

What do the "white" spaces represent ??

I guess Colorado had some counties that were too close to call when this image was made.

[Jolie Rouge]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

This refers to the 2000 Bush/Gore election and even Snopes doesn't give it a plain "true" or "False" but a "Multiple Findings"

[Jolie Rouge]

I guess Colorado had some counties that were too close to call when this image was made.

I know which are the state boundries .... :doh: But in the middle of CO in the map above is an unusally squared "lake" ... odd since the Pontratrain in LA nor Obeechanobee in FL( how is that spelled ?) show. Manatees do not vote ... ;)

[DrHolliday]

This refers to the 2000 Bush/Gore election and even Snopes doesn't give it a plain "true" or "False" but a "Multiple Findings"

You don't expect an Obama supporter to actually read the facts, do you? :lol

[Jolie Rouge]

I have found over the last few months ... that when it comes to political "posts" at Snopes that are leaning to the left ... way left

[DrHolliday]

I have found over the last few months ... that when it comes to political "posts" at Snopes that are leaning to the left ... way left

That is indeed the case. Which probably explains why Bahet never bothered to read her own link. :rolleyes:

[dangerousfem]

wow.. look at all the red... yet we have BHO.... wow

[Jackie_Blu]

I have found over the last few months ... that when it comes to political "posts" at Snopes that are leaning to the left ... way left

I was alerted to this fact through email a few months ago. Thats when I stopped putting any stock in their political posts.

[Jackie_Blu]

wow.. look at all the red... yet we have BHO.... wow

LOL mind-boggling, isnt it?

[DrHolliday]

wow.. look at all the red... yet we have BHO.... wow

You can thank all those people living in the highly populated urban areas. They tend to want bigger government and more government programs. :slap

[ahippiechic]

wow.. look at all the red... yet we have BHO.... wow

I said almost the same thing in 2004! :slap

[dangerousfem]

I said almost the same thing in 2004! :slap

hey...that hurt..lol....:rolling

[ahippiechic]

hey...that hurt..lol....:rolling

It didn't hurt! You might have fell down but I see you on the floor laughing! :star:

[Bahet]

That is indeed the case. Which probably explains why Bahet never bothered to read her own link. :rolleyes:

Hello??? Is this thing on?? I VOTED FOR MCCAIN!! Maybe I should borrow that head up the butt avatar of ITN. Can you hear me now? I posted a link and made not one other comment yet you've said I didn't read it and I'm an Obama supporter. Perhaps it's you who should read the words posted instead of constantly reading in your own opinions.

[DrHolliday]

Hello??? Is this thing on?? I VOTED FOR MCCAIN!! Maybe I should borrow that head up the butt avatar of ITN. Can you hear me now? I posted a link and made not one other comment yet you've said I didn't read it and I'm an Obama supporter. Perhaps it's you who should read the words posted instead of constantly reading in your own opinions.

So you admit to posting a link to a worthless snopes article and then say I have my head up my butt? LOL :lol

[Bahet]

Are you obtuse on purpose?

I posted a link to a snopes article that showed that the exact same "observations" were made 8 years ago. You may not agree with Snope's findings. Ok, then do your own research and prove it wrong. Or at least prove that Snopes is incorrect. Seems to me thy posted some statistics that should be easy enough to prove or disprove.

[whatever]

I have found over the last few months ... that when it comes to political "posts" at Snopes that are leaning to the left ... way left
I don't put alot of stock in them period.

wow.. look at all the red... yet we have BHO.... wow
Questionable isn't?

I was alerted to this fact through email a few months ago. Thats when I stopped putting any stock in their political posts.

Me too.......

[IthinkNOT!]

Here ya go:
http://radio.weblogs.com/0001014/images/2003/03/20/headUpAss.jpg

[DrHolliday]

Here ya go:
http://radio.weblogs.com/0001014/images/2003/03/20/headUpAss.jpg

Good pic of the typical Obama supporter.:rofl:

[DrHolliday]

Are you obtuse on purpose?

I posted a link to a snopes article that showed that the exact same "observations" were made 8 years ago. You may not agree with Snope's findings. Ok, then do your own research and prove it wrong. Or at least prove that Snopes is incorrect. Seems to me thy posted some statistics that should be easy enough to prove or disprove.

As I said in my opening post, the email had been recycled, and that the situation had become even more grave. The snopes "findings" were totally irrelevant, as is your defense of them.

In the future, you may want to post a comment as to your thoughts instead of just posting a link to worthless "findings".

As all these bailouts PROVE, this country is enterring stage 7 "From apathy to dependence." You can agrue that is not true all you like, this is a free country, but you won't find many that agree with you. Then again, Obama got 52% of the vote so maybe you will.

[Bahet]

Why bother posting a comment? You are just going to read your own view into it anyhow? The 7 stages are made up and bogus. You can't move to a stage that doesn't exist. This past election shows that this country was anything but apathetic. More and more people are getting involved in politics and how the country is run than they have in generations. People are involved. They care about the issues. They care about the world around them and what happens in it. That has only really happened in the past 60 years or so. Prior to WWII the US wasn't involved in what happened in the world. The citizens sure didn't care. We've gone from not knowing or caring what happens to anyone else to knowing and caring what happens around the world. That's not apathy.

There was always some form of dependency. There were bread lines in the 1930s. A larger percentage of the population was dependant on the government for it's very existence then than there is now. The spectrum of our dependency has changed greatly. People no longer depend on social security to fund their retirement. They are no longer dependant on one company for a certain product. They are no longer dependant on seasons for fresh fruit and veggies. We have major technological advances that allow people who are bedridden to work where not that long ago they would be dependant on the government to take care of them. There are all sorts of dependencies. I'm sure you are only talking about those dependant on some form of welfare but if that's the case, it was worse in the past than it is now.

[DrHolliday]

Wow.

If you don't think the citizens of this country are getting more and more dependent every passing day then you obviously are not watching the news and reading the newspaper, or even talking to your neighbors.

[IthinkNOT!]

Good pic of the typical Obama supporter.:rofl:
Actually, I was thinking that it reminds me of some of the people here that refuse to pull their head out of their ass and see the world around them.

[Jolie Rouge]

As I said in my opening post, the email had been recycled, and that the situation had become even more grave. The snopes "findings" were totally irrelevant, as is your defense of them.

In the future, you may want to post a comment as to your thoughts instead of just posting a link to worthless "findings".

As all these bailouts PROVE, this country is enterring stage 7 "From apathy to dependence." You can agrue that is not true all you like, this is a free country, but you won't find many that agree with you. Then again, Obama got 52% of the vote so maybe you will.


Don't you mean Obama bought 52% of the vote ?


This past election shows that this country was anything but apathetic.

When it was discussed prior to the election ... the voter registration "irregularities", the campaign finace "irregularities", the unanswered questions, the smears and the attacks ... the reponse from the media ... and hence what the common voter was exposed to ... was certainly "apathetic" at best; obstructionist at worst.... But for some, the end justifies the means, eh ?

[atprm]

YAY JOLIE IS BACK!!!! YIPPEEE!!!!!!!! woot woot!!!

[Jolie Rouge]

Did anyone notice I was gone ??

I KNOW I missed you guys ! :hugs: :flowers: How was everyone's holidays ?

[atprm]

Did anyone notice I was gone ??

I KNOW I missed you guys ! :hugs: :flowers: How was everyone's holidays ?


I noticed -- my post count has gone way up trying to cover for you!! Don't do that crap again... not even with notice!! :getyou

it's tough posting articles. LOL

[Jolie Rouge]

Trust me .. if it ever comes up again ... I and my entire immediate family is going to suddenly come down with a brief yet highly contagious illness.