Need advice about DS's report card

[andreame70]

Here I am again asking for some insight from my friends at BBS. I am pretty angry about this, but I wanted to see what you guys thought about it before I actually handle it at school tomorrow.

My son, who is 9 (in the 3rd grade) got his report card today. The school runs on 9 week grading periods, so this was his second report card of the year. Last report card he scored middle to upper 90's on all subjects.

His Health/Science subjects are combined into one class with one grade. Last report card, he scored a 99 on Health/Science, his report card today showed a 79, a 20 point drop from last report card.

Immediately, I felt like something had to be wrong. I have looked over all of his graded papers and for the life of me, I could not remember any grades which were low enough to justify this, so I called his teacher to ask about it.

I was told that over the 9 week period, she had selected 6 assignments to base their total grade for the 9 weeks on. His scores on those 6 assignments were: 100, 100, 100, 82, 94 and 0 (zero.) I never remembered him receiving a zero so I asked what it was for. She stated that several weeks ago, he had a HOMEWORK paper about the moon. The instructions on the homework paper stated to answer the questions in complete sentences. My son answered the questions, but failed to answer them in complete sentences, so she gave him a zero for the assignment. She said she was certain that his answers were correct, but gave him the zero because they were not answered in the correct form. She even stated that approx. half of the class made the same mistake and they were all given zero's as well.

My son is having a hard time with this and so am I. He takes his grades very seriously and I have told him not to worry about it, just keep doing the best he can. That is all I can ask for. His main problem is that this one zero has caused him to not make the honor roll, which has been a goal of his since he accomplished it the first nine weeks.

For the life of me, I cannot understand how one homework assignment can carry so much weight. This one homework paper is accounting for 16.67% of his grade in that class for the entire 9 weeks! Am I the only one who thinks that this one homework assignment is accounting for too much weight in his total grade? Not to mention the fact that out of 9 weeks of work, only 6 assignments were used in the total calculation of his grade. This just seems wrong to me.

Using this formula, it would appear that the teacher has control over what grade they ultimately receive, based on which papers she chooses to count and how much weight she applies to each assignment. Something about that just doesn't make sense to me.

To me, a zero on a paper would indicate that the child either never turned in the paper, or turned it in with no answers written on it at all. Should the fact that he did not answer in complete sentences justify a total zero? I fully understand the need for the children to follow the directions they are given and I am not trying to make lightly of that, but I do feel that since it was turned in on time and he did answer the questions, he should at least deserve a 50 on it, or something.

I am still up in the air about what I should do. I pick my battles wisely, but I just don't think I can let this go without at least voicing my opinion to her about how I feel. My son is really disappointed over this grade, even more than I am. I don't think I can let it go without showing him that some things like this are worth debating. What do you guys think?

Andrea

[sea-shell]

In my opinion that is wrong on the teachers part. Boy talk about making the kids feel like sh*t. I say go for it - some teachers like to play God :(

[killbarney]

I'm sorry-what that teacher is doing is WRONG. She CANNOT select what grades to base the ending grade on. I'm not even going to go into the zero for the homework not being EXACTLY what she asked for-our teachers have more common sense.

It sounds like you need to go in and have a face-to-face with the teacher and the principal. And if that doesn't get satisfaction take it to the school board.

I assumed that all schools were the same when it came to counting ALL of your work to get your average. I wonder how the teacher would have liked that approach when she was in college? Or on her continuing ed courses?

I'd be p.o.'d, too.

[kyswpgrl]

Yeah, I'd be really upset as well. No, he didn't follow the directions completely. However, he still answered the questions and she didn't even bother to check the accuracy of his answers. Sounds to me like she was just peeved that the class hasn't been listening to her and decided this would be her way of getting the point across. I don't agree with her tactics though. I feel the parents should have received a note home explaining the assignment and to check their child's work before it was turned in. She should have also sent an explanation home regarding the grade. BUT that doesn't excuse what she did. I think the teacher needs to sit back down with all of the zero papers and at least give them credit for turning the work in. If they were going to get a zero, what's the point in turning in their homework at all?

[tngirl]

I would imagine that she selected these particular assignments at the beginning of the school year or at least the beginning of the new grading period. I wouldn't be happy about the zero, but the best thing is to go talk to the teacher so you can have a better understanding on how and why she selected these assignments to use the grades. And of course to understand why she gave a zero instead of a partial grade. But, if she had asked for complete sentences and the paper was turned in without the appropriate answers, then they would be considered incomplete.

[hblueeyes]

I agree with you. Talk with the teacher and question her as to how she determines which assignments grades will be based on. This seems so stupid to me. (Maybe the school should only pay her for certain days she works). I would also talk to the principle about this as well. Be sure to mention the psychological effect this is having on your child. Teachers need to be more aware of the life long effects they have on our children. We can all remember that one teacher who took a little more time with us or gave us a good feeling about ourselves but we also hang onto the memories of those that were unfair or who picked on someone.
By speaking to the teacher, you are also showiing your son that when things do not seem right that it is ok to question it. He will also feel good that you are validating his feelings and that can be very powerful.

me:p

[iluvmybaby]

I would make an appointment with the schools principal. You seem to have done the right thing, you contact the teacher and tried to address the problem, when it was not solved in an approperiate way, it is time to take it the next step

[freeby4me]

If I did no homework then I recieved a zero in school. If I completed the work but not in correct form (Back then it was typed and printed, which we didnt have access to) then I would recieve 50%. That is still a failing grade but when you look at percentage that 50% added in.
I say call the school and set up an appointment with the principle and teacher because this is just not fair to the students at all. This is a critical time in the school forming years and teaching them that "You did the homework but not up to MY standards so Im failing you" will teach them that no matter what they do it wont be right.

[PrincessArky]

I would make an appointment with the schools principal. You seem to have done the right thing, you contact the teacher and tried to address the problem, when it was not solved in an approperiate way, it is time to take it the next step

exactly you went through the first proper channel now on to the next........I see no reason why your son should have gotten a 0 I agree that she could have taken off pts if it wasn't done correctly but at the same time my god the little guy is only in 3rd grade. I have one in 3rd and one in 6th and the pressures they put on these kids are terrible

[andreame70]

I took my son into school this morning and asked to speak the the Principal. He was not there, so I went into a conference with the Asst. Principal.

I introduced myself and showed her my sons report card. I began telling her about how the Health/Science grade seemed wrong and I explained how I called the teacher yesterday afternoon and spoke to her about the grade. Once I began explaining that only six grades were used to determine his final grade and the fact that one of them was merely a homework assignment, I seemed to really get her attention.

I asked her, based on his other grades (100, 100, 100, 82, 94 and one zero) how a 79 could accurately reflect his grade for the entire 9 weeks. I asked how over 9 weeks, there could only be 6 assignments to entirely base his grade on. I also asked how one homework paper could logically account for 16.67% of his entire grade for the 9 weeks. She stated that she wanted to know as well.

I told her that I really do like his teacher. She and I have been able to communicate well so far this year and I in no way wanted to cause her any trouble, I just feel like the formula being used is not fair.

She stated that she would speak to his teacher about it immediately and she took down my cell phone number to call me back as soon as she was able to put all of this together. She asked me if it was OK to make a copy of my sons report card, which I certainly allowed her to do.

In closing to her, I confirmed that I understood how important it is for the children to follow directions. I agree that if he did not complete the assignment according to the directions, even if the answers were correct, he would not deserve a 100. But since he completed it, turned it in on time and felt he had done the assignment correctly, he does not deserve a zero for it either.

I am anxiously waiting for them to call me back to see what happens with this. Thanks a lot for everyone's replies, I appreciate being able to have all of you as my personal sounding board. Sometimes, just getting validation and/or other opinions really helps!

I will follow up later, when I hear back from the school.

Andrea

[PrincessArky]

I sure hope that they are able to at least give your son particle credit for his work. My daughter (also in 3rd) grade makes mistakes like this and she is also one of the kids that has A+ all the way through. Her teacher is great and will always give her credit even if she makes a mistake like this one

[ladyfoob]

When I was in 3rd grade my teacher had us all do this homework paper. We had to chose a person to interview and come up with a topic and write down your questions. Well, I missunderstood for some reason and I just wrote down questions to ask w/o making a topic on it. I didn't recive a zero on b/c I did do the paper and interviewed the person. My grade just was 50%! Now, with this problem with your son's teacher should have done a least the same thing. He did do the paper and he did answer to the best of his knowlege. I feel you should really bring this up even more to the teacher. You and your son is in the right! Hopefully something happens. This is really hurting your son, doesn't this teacher have any feelings at all. A zero should only be given if don't do the work!

[SLance68]

Ok I am going to play devils advocate here. If your son wrote complete sentences that in no way were related to the questions would he still get partial credit since he wrote complete sentences? More than likely he would have also received a zero. Part of education is to learn to follow directions and if he has Mom go to the principal everytime he doesn't follow directions then he will only learn that he can do what he want's and Mom will make sure he gets points for it. As for basing grades on 6 assignments - that is not unusual and it is up to the teacher as to what she bases for her grading system. While it is unfortunate that your son didn't make the honor roll I would guess that he will pay more attention to the instructions given for future assignments so that he can get back on the honor roll.

Go ahead and Flame Away.

[PrincessArky]

Ok I am going to play devils advocate here. If your son wrote complete sentences that in no way were related to the questions would he still get partial credit since he wrote complete sentences? More than likely he would have also received a zero. Part of education is to learn to follow directions and if he has Mom go to the principal everytime he doesn't follow directions then he will only learn that he can do what he want's and Mom will make sure he gets points for it. As for basing grades on 6 assignments - that is not unusual and it is up to the teacher as to what she bases for her grading system. While it is unfortunate that your son didn't make the honor roll I would guess that he will pay more attention to the instructions given for future assignments so that he can get back on the honor roll.

Go ahead and Flame Away.

oh yeah you are so right I mean who ever thought of giving a break to a 3rd grader :rolleyes:

[Pepsi4me]

Ok I am going to play devils advocate here. If your son wrote complete sentences that in no way were related to the questions would he still get partial credit since he wrote complete sentences? More than likely he would have also received a zero. Part of education is to learn to follow directions and if he has Mom go to the principal everytime he doesn't follow directions then he will only learn that he can do what he want's and Mom will make sure he gets points for it. As for basing grades on 6 assignments - that is not unusual and it is up to the teacher as to what she bases for her grading system. While it is unfortunate that your son didn't make the honor roll I would guess that he will pay more attention to the instructions given for future assignments so that he can get back on the honor roll.

Go ahead and Flame Away.


I kinda agree with you. He didnt follow the direction & he does need to learn to follow directions completly.

My daughter is in the 3rd grade also. When she doesnt do full sentences on an assignment when its called for the teacher will send it home & she will have to redo it. This has happened one time & I have reminded her to read the directions & do what they say.

[kyswpgrl]

I kinda agree with you. He didnt follow the direction & he does need to learn to follow directions completly.

My daughter is in the 3rd grade also. When she doesnt do full sentences on an assignment when its called for the teacher will send it home & she will have to redo it. This has happened one time & I have reminded her to read the directions & do what they say.

Yeah, but she's allowed to correct herself. The teacher doesn't just give her a zero and say, "Your effort means nothing."

[JKATHERINE]

My daughter is in the 3rd grade also. When she doesnt do full sentences on an assignment when its called for the teacher will send it home & she will have to redo it. This has happened one time & I have reminded her to read the directions & do what they say.

Yeah, but as you said, your daughter has the opportunity to redo the assignment. It sure doesn't seem as though Andrea's son had that chance. This is crazy. The kid's only in 3rd grade. He needs to be given a break. And, as far as the grading system goes, well, SOME teachers do do that, but they are not normally elementary teachers, they are high school teachers and college professors AND they let you know how papers/projects/assignments are going to be weighted. If they're only going to be graded on six assignments, why bother doing all the other ones at all?

[Pepsi4me]

Yeah, but she's allowed to correct herself. The teacher doesn't just give her a zero and say, "Your effort means nothing."



Yes,I agree. Thats what I was saying...my daughters teacher lets them correct it but, then all teachers are not the same.

Directions were not followed completely.

[tngirl]

The other assignments are leading up to and preparing the student for those that will be graded. Homework does not always carry a grade and is used for practice. I would assume that the paper in question is a big part of what was learned in the class and that is why it carries such a high percentange of the grade.

As for giving someone a break because they are just a 3rd grader? What message is that sending to them. If they don't follow intstructions that is okay? The assignment was not done per the instructions so in other words, the answers were wrong. Yeah, it sucks that he got a zero and it sucks that he did not make honor roll. I made my children's grades their responsibility so they would understand the importance of studying and paying attention in class.

[SLance68]

One thing that you didn't mention - were the directions for the homework assignment given verbally or verbally and a written page to take home? If it was verbal only I could understand most of the children forgetting the "complete sentences" part. However, if it was written (either copies distributed by the teacher or copied off the board by the student) and sent home then there is no reason that so many of the kids failed the assignment. I am sure that part of the things they are learning at this time are how to make complete sentences and that was why it was a important part of the assignment.

[andreame70]

Well, I have good news! The teacher called me this evening and said that she had been in a conference with the Asst Principal. She agreed that in retrospect, the zero was a little harsh and even said that she probably should have given all of the students who did not write the answers correctly the chance to re-do the homework sheet for a lesser grade. She explained that there were two or three in the class who always failed to follow directions, however she said my son was not one of them. She agreed that it was not fair and has decided to give him half credit on the worksheet for his effort.

The 50 averaged in with the rest of his grades in that class will give him an
88. This will put him back on the A-B honor roll, which accomplishes his goal.
He is extremely happy and he has learned several valuable lessons from this:

1) Always follow directions

2) Don't be afraid to ask questions and speak up if you feel you something is not right.

He knows that I will always support him. But at the same time, he knows he will catch you know what if he is in the wrong. He is no stranger to discipline. Some battles are worth fighting for and some are not. I felt that this one was and his teacher, after looking back on it, agreed. After the disappointment of thinking he was not making the honor roll after all of his hard work, you can bet that he will be on top of his game from here on out.

Thanks for all the replies and have a good night everyone.

Andrea

[queenangie]

Glad to hear the outcome was agreeable to all.

This was a learning experience for your son and I am glad you were there to support him.

Next time, he will be certain to follow the instructions.

[PrincessArky]

Well, I have good news! The teacher called me this evening and said that she had been in a conference with the Asst Principal. She agreed that in retrospect, the zero was a little harsh and even said that she probably should have given all of the students who did not write the answers correctly the chance to re-do the homework sheet for a lesser grade. She explained that there were two or three in the class who always failed to follow directions, however she said my son was not one of them. She agreed that it was not fair and has decided to give him half credit on the worksheet for his effort.

The 50 averaged in with the rest of his grades in that class will give him an
88. This will put him back on the A-B honor roll, which accomplishes his goal.
He is extremely happy and he has learned several valuable lessons from this:

1) Always follow directions

2) Don't be afraid to ask questions and speak up if you feel you something is not right.

He knows that I will always support him. But at the same time, he knows he will catch you know what if he is in the wrong. He is no stranger to discipline. Some battles are worth fighting for and some are not. I felt that this one was and his teacher, after looking back on it, agreed. After the disappointment of thinking he was not making the honor roll after all of his hard work, you can bet that he will be on top of his game from here on out.

Thanks for all the replies and have a good night everyone.

Andrea


so glad all worked out well because even though it appears I feel differently than most, I believed he deserved at least a partial break.

[Myssi76]

Ok I am going to play devils advocate here. If your son wrote complete sentences that in no way were related to the questions would he still get partial credit since he wrote complete sentences? More than likely he would have also received a zero. Part of education is to learn to follow directions and if he has Mom go to the principal everytime he doesn't follow directions then he will only learn that he can do what he want's and Mom will make sure he gets points for it. As for basing grades on 6 assignments - that is not unusual and it is up to the teacher as to what she bases for her grading system. While it is unfortunate that your son didn't make the honor roll I would guess that he will pay more attention to the instructions given for future assignments so that he can get back on the honor roll.

Go ahead and Flame Away.

I agree with this, but that's mainly because I am a teachers daughter. We are taught from an early age to follow directions. If directions are not followed its wrong. Even though he gave the right answers he did not do it correctly there for its a zero. As for only choosing what she will account for his grades, I know going to school we did many things, some were graded for our report card some where not. I know as a parent it really does stink. I have children also and would not be happy about it but also this is a life lesson about following directions that your son will probably not soon forget or repeat.

This isn't about cutting a 3rd grader some slack or giving him a break. Its about school. Doing what your told to do and following directions.. It's called Learning. If teachers do not grade kids on ALL the directions what is next saying well you where close to spelling the word right so we will mark it as correct on a spelling test.. Just a comparison and mho.

But good luck to your son and you through this. I am glad you got the outcome you wanted and your son was granted the grade you felt he should get. :)

[andreame70]

I am glad you got the outcome you wanted and your son was granted the grade you felt he should get. :)

Myssi76, this is not at all about what grade I felt he should get. It was only about a fair determination of what grade depicted an accurate description of the quality of work my son completed for the entire 9 weeks.

The other grades he had in that subject for the 9 weeks were 100, 100, 100, 82, 94. If the teacher had been able to honestly state that a 79 was an accurate assessment of the quality of work he produced for that entire grading period, then it would have stayed a 79 and I would have had no problem with that. I would have encouraged him to work harder to bring it up to the best of his ability.

The problem was that this one single homework worksheet accounted for 16.67% of his entire grade for the 9 weeks. Had the zero on that one paper been averaged with his other homework papers for that same 9 weeks, then it would not have made such a profound difference in his grade. All of those grades averaged together would have been a more accurate assessment of the quality of his work. The fact that this was the only homework worksheet to be counted was not fair to him or the rest of the kids in that class.

The teacher agreed after looking back, that it was unfair to all of the kids for this one homework worksheet to carry that much weight. That is why she changed it to give him partial credit for his effort. She has never had any problems in the past with him not following directions. He made an honest mistake and I made sure before I even went to school that morning, that he was prepared to live with that. I have never contested a grade before, so I was really not expecting it to change. I just wanted it to be known that I thought the formula used to determine the final grade was not fair to the kids.

If the teacher honestly felt that a 79 was an accurate measurement of the quality of his work, then she would not have considered changing it, it would have stayed the same.

Andrea

[Myssi76]

Myssi76, this is not at all about what grade I felt he should get. It was only about a fair determination of what grade depicted an accurate description of the quality of work my son completed for the entire 9 weeks.

But it was not a fair determination.. He did not do the work correctly on that worksheet. There for he got the correct grade. You went in and disputed it so that your son would get the grade you felt he deserved.

The other grades he had in that subject for the 9 weeks were 100, 100, 100, 82, 94. If the teacher had been able to honestly state that a 79 was an accurate assessment of the quality of work he produced for that entire grading period, then it would have stayed a 79 and I would have had no problem with that. I would have encouraged him to work harder to bring it up to the best of his ability.

It doest not matter if he got straight A's for the whole 9 weeks, All it takes is one bad grade to lower the whole bit of hard work. As you learned.


The teacher agreed after looking back, that it was unfair to all of the kids for this one homework worksheet to carry that much weight. That is why she changed it to give him partial credit for his effort. She has never had any problems in the past with him not following directions. He made an honest mistake and I made sure before I even went to school that morning, that he was prepared to live with that. I have never contested a grade before, so I was really not expecting it to change. I just wanted it to be known that I thought the formula used to determine the final grade was not fair to the kids.

This is common practice in school for a teacher to pick what items she will use to grade for the whole 9 weeks. If she had picked one he got an A on there would have been no dispute and you would have been happy. But as it turned out she picked the one he had not follow the directions on so it was an issue. Your stating that she picked only 6, but had the 6 she picked would have been his best grades you would have no dispute. Thats a double standard.

If the teacher honestly felt that a 79 was an accurate measurement of the quality of his work, then she would not have considered changing it, it would have stayed the same.

As my mother said, A lot of times a teacher will just go ahead and give the parent what they want and agree with them. Even though they don't. This is a teacher who doesnt want to deal with confrontation. I asked my mom about this she said the grade would have stuck he didnt do the work correctly but she also would have given him a 10% for effort and that would have been all. 50% was to much because he didnt even do half the page correctly. All he did was put the correct answers down.

Andrea


Whats fair to you doesnt seem to fair to me. I have a child in 5th grade right now. She brought a paper sort of like what your son did she hurried and did not pay attention. This was my chance to teach her a valuable lesson. I did not go to the school asking for the grade to be changed because I felt it not fair. It was fair she didnt do it right. What I did do was call her teacher and say as you know this does not show my daughters true work she is a straight A student. Is there anything she can do to bring up her grade. The teacher then explained she had already taken part in the extra credit she gives out for kids wanting to bring up the grade. Her lesson taught her to take her time, read everything and make sure things are done correctly. In no way am I trying to bash you, this is just my opinion and if anything I type comes off like an attack or meanly please understand that is not my intent just sometimes when things are online its hard to get the correct feelings across.

Once again, I am glad it worked out for you both in the end. :) :) Wow this is long, but I did not want you to think I was attacking you :)