can someone answer this

[mimi37]

My mother was diagnosed with cancer the beginning of March. From almost the very beginning, the doctors and nurses have been telling us to look into hospice. My sister did ask about the services they provide. She was told they don't believe in giving medication of any kind, just narcotics to ease the pain. Also, my mother is on a feeding tube because she has cancer in her esophagus and has been having some problems with swallowing. We were told that under hospice she would not be allowed to have a feeding tube. So basically, no medication and starve to death. :( We just feel to see how this is supposed to be easing her discomfort. To me that is like handing her a death sentence. I mean I know she is terminal. But why make her suffer more and starve her? :confused:

[janelle]

Mimi, I'm so sorry you are going through this. We just did. Do you have more than one hospice in your area? Talk to all of them and get the one who has your outlook on end of life.

Read their literature. Hospice is an end of life support service so they can't really be used if someone is recovering and getting well.

We wanted a hospice that believed in keeping the patient as comfortable as possible. Giving pain meds as needed--when the patient wanted it. My FIL was losing his appitite and they did not want to give him a med that would increase his appitite even though it worked when he had taken it at the beginning of his illness. And no feeding tube. We were uncomfortable with this since it would have prolonged his life.

It's hard for the family not to try to do whatever is possible to prolong the love ones life even though he was in constant pain if he was without the morphine.

In retrospect it may have been a blessing not to have prolonged his suffering even though we felt it was the best thing to do. When one is dying the body starts to shut down and it will not take in food. Whatever is given will be thrown up. Hospice has literature on the process of dying and what the body will go through.

My FIL got very malnourished before he died but it was the body shutting down. He was on morphine so that would have taken care of the hunger pains.

A good hospice will help you and your family through this tramatic time. They are suppose to be there for the patient as well as for the family. Talk to them about your concerns. I think that is the hardest thing when someone is dying, to let nature take it's course or try to reverse the process. Even if the patient eats the body will reject the food and that is also very hard to keep throwing up.

I think my FIL died a peaceful death. He had the pain meds, his body naturally shut down. He ate less and slept more until his heart stopped. He had terminal lung cancer. My husband felt they should have done more for him but I think everyone feels that way no matter what is done. Even is he was given every med and a feeding tube we would still have felt more should have been done. That's natural when we lose a love one. Part of the greiving process.

I know this is a very hard time for you and will be praying for you and your mother. Huggs.

[DivineMsDi]

No advice....just keeping you and yours in my prayers.

[mimi37]

The thing is, she complains of no cancer pain. The only pain she says she has is from her arthritis. We have asked her repeatedly if she has any pain anywhere else and she always says no. They were giving her pureed foods and clear liquids in addition to the feeding tube. She is not throwing up at all. I could see if she couldn't keep anything down. Then it would probably be more harmful to her if she was throwing up all the time. But why take her food away from her and leave her starve. She is still well aware of everything that is going on. if we stopped feeding her, that is like saying we've given up on her.

[Tasha405]

I am so sorry you are going through this. I don't have any advice but I wanted to let you know that you and your family will be in my thoughts and prayers. {{{{Hugs}}}}

[Freebeemom]

My grandpa was in hospice for a very short time once the cancer was in his bloodstream. It was he who decided that he wanted to take that test. He did not want to go through more tests and pokes and all the other uncomfortability that goes along with it. I think that death is much harder on the living than the dying. I truly hope that your experience with hospice (if you choose that route) is as good is ours was. It was a wonderful lesson on the grace of death.....

God bless you and your family.

[nanajoanie]

My hubby/soulmate, Tice died of lung cancer Christmas eve afternoon. Hospice was in our home several times a week monitoring him. Yes the meds are usually narcotics since Hospice only just does terminal patients and to make them as comfortable as possible. Towards the end Tice didn't even want some of his breathing machines with meds in them. The nurses said to left him have his way. He was on 2 different kinds of morphine, oxy-contin, liquid Albuterol, plus a couple others. All of this took place in 3 months. I would recommend Hospice to anyone. They are there as much or as little as you want them, non-judgemental, caring, compassionate. And absolutely free. I listed them as the preferred charity and nearly everyone donated to them in his name :)

Good luck dear with whatever you decide. Prayers and huggles to you and the family.

[badswife]

My prayers are with you.

[schsa]

Hospice is death with dignity. She will die pain free and comfortable. It will be peaceful without struggle. I would highly recommend it to anyone. Your mother deserves to die as she lived. If you continue to feed her all you are doing is allowing the cancer to grow and kill her slowly and far more painfully.

Love her enough to do this for her. Don't allow her to suffer or be in any pain. Hospice will help both of you.

[mimi37]

I just fail to see how it is helping if she is not allowed to have oxygen, she is not allowed to have her IV, she is not allowed to have her feeding tube. Taking all these things away would put her in pain and cause more discomfort than she is already in.

[flute]

Yes, I agree with the others,I wasn't at my grandpa's side when he died, I was there a half hour later, but I know he died peacefully. It may have been much more painful had Hospice not been there.
We owe them a lot. My mother (mostly) and father dealt with hospice for grandpa (he was living with mom & dad...after grandma died, and dad's brother said stick him in a home :rolleyes: )

I know my mom would recommend hospice to anyone.

[janelle]

End of life issues are very hard in our society. Hospice if free but then they have rules not to do things to keep the patient alive for as long as possible.

I know how you feel about the feeding tube. Personally, I would want to keep letting her have it as long as she is doing well with it and wants it.

Talk to the hospice people about it. Tell them how you feel about taking her nourishment away. How long do the doctors give her? We know we cannot live longer than ten days without water. I'm sure they will keep giving her water as long as she wants it.

If your mother is doing well without that much pain and keeping her food down maybe you will want to wait awhile before you get hospice. Is she in a nursing home or at your home?

My FIL died three months after the diagnosis. The doctors gave him six months. He was on an anti-depressant to keep his spirits up but about all he could get down were malts. They would bring him a room tray. He had dentures and couldn't use his right hand from a stroke he had years ago. I wasn't there (different city) so I don't know how much they helped him eat. My husband went over during his lunch break to help him eat.

Try to get your family to help you now and get as much help as you can. People are willing and wanting to help you. Take advantage of all that help. I know you want to be there for your mother. Use your time with her well. Do what you can to connect with her and make it a precious time. Remember you are not alone. Many of us on this board have gone through this. We understand.

[menanamama]

My mother was diagnosed with cancer the beginning of March. From almost the very beginning, the doctors and nurses have been telling us to look into hospice. My sister did ask about the services they provide. She was told they don't believe in giving medication of any kind, just narcotics to ease the pain. Also, my mother is on a feeding tube because she has cancer in her esophagus and has been having some problems with swallowing. We were told that under hospice she would not be allowed to have a feeding tube. So basically, no medication and starve to death. :( We just feel to see how this is supposed to be easing her discomfort. To me that is like handing her a death sentence. I mean I know she is terminal. But why make her suffer more and starve her? :confused:
not true at all....i work with hospice patients. hospice requires that a patient (or client as i call them) be accepting of their fate so to speak. they require that you not be in full fight mode i suppose. meaning you realise you are going to go and are not trying radical measures and treatments to prolong life. they do allow feeding tubes...would be murder if not....but they may not assist with the feedings. they do allow medications....to provide comfort. they would never starve her. the point of hospice is to provide a terminal client a quality of life during the final phases of their disease. i hope i don't sound hard and brutal but that is what it boils down to....comfort and care....not false hopes. also it requires a dr. that says he expects the client to pass within a year. around here that is what it is like. i urge you to call a local hospice and speak to the directly because each service is different.

[menanamama]

also...they pay all client costs. no fee to you ever. very worthwhile.

[mimi37]

[QUOTE=h2223m they do allow feeding tubes

We met with a woman from hospice tonight. She said that she would not be allowed her feeding tube as hospice does not believe in using artificial means to sustain life. The doctors and nurses have been pushing my mother all day telling her she has no choice but hospice and have convinced her of this. So she finally agreed to this. My sister and I do not agree with this but told her if this is her decision then we will abide by it. The woman from hospice told us that if we do not agree, than my mother can not receive their service. The way hospice was explained to my mother was that they will do whatever they can to keep her comfortable. When my sister explained to her that that meant no feeding tube, she did not understand why she would not get the feeding tube.

[justinenycole26]

First of all {{{{HUGS}}}}

I don't understand it either. I get the part about not using artificial means to keep someone alive, but your mother is totally conscious and cognizant of what is going on. How can they just let her starve? I really do not get this. I am not trying to upset you more, just trying to understand. Is there more than one Hospice agency in your area?

I am so sorry you have to deal with this!

[mimi37]

Every hospice agency we've spoke with has the same beliefs. The doctor has already taken the feeding tube out. :( So now she will only get whatever food she can tolerate. The only things she can rally have are clear broth and jello because of her problems with swallowing. Certainly not enough to sustain her. :(

[vicky122]

I am sorry you are going through this. My brother had hospice and we wouldn't have it any other way. They not only helped him but they also helped us. I don't know about the feeding tube my brother would eat what ever he could. But he did throw it up and then at one point he stopped eating. Hospice went thru all the steps with us and was very caring with my brother. If it wasn't for them I am not sure how we would of made it.

[menanamama]

We met with a woman from hospice tonight. She said that she would not be allowed her feeding tube as hospice does not believe in using artificial means to sustain life. The doctors and nurses have been pushing my mother all day telling her she has no choice but hospice and have convinced her of this. So she finally agreed to this. My sister and I do not agree with this but told her if this is her decision then we will abide by it. The woman from hospice told us that if we do not agree, than my mother can not receive their service. The way hospice was explained to my mother was that they will do whatever they can to keep her comfortable. When my sister explained to her that that meant no feeding tube, she did not understand why she would not get the feeding tube.that is really messed up...our hospice is not like that. guess it is different everywhere.

[janelle]

Can you be the caregiver for your mother right now? Call in hospice later.

Personally, if my mother wanted the feeding tube I would learn how to do it and I would take care of it for her. You are lucky your mother knows what is going on so you can communicate with her and learn what her final wishes are. You can talk about so much if she is willing.

If she is in a carehome and you have the power of attorney for her you can make all the decisions for her. You also need a medical power of attorney to make medical decisions for her.

[queenangie]

An individual who is alert & oriented to time, place, and person continues to make his/her own decisions w/ regards to their health care & finances.

If she is not alert & oriented, then the power of attorney for healthcare makes Mother's health decisions.

The power of attorney for finances makes decisions about finances (paying the bills only, not for decisions on her healthcare at all).
These are 2 different things.

I have a sense there is much more going on here and different family members are getting different information. You all need to have a sitdown 'family conference w/ the mother, the doctor, the social worker, and the family' to help determine what your mother truly wishes, what hospice has available, and the estimated end of life concerns. If your mother's doctor has pushed for hospice, it means she has 6 months or less until the end.

Hospice does cover everything $$$$. It includes medications, equipment, nursing, volunteers, etc. Some hospice agencies have certain rules when you sign the contract. If you have allready spoken to more than one hospice, there is a reason that you are hearing the same thing from them. I believe you all need the family conference to get on the same page about your mother's health.

So sorry to hear about your mother. Will be praying for your family too.

[janelle]

But talk to your mother now about the power of attorney and medical power. Talk to her when she can still tell you her desires. Please do not wait until she can't tell you. Get those papers signed.

If your mother is religious a priest or minister may be able to help.

[VALENA-)45]

i have no advice. my mother was in a coma when she passed away. i made all of the decigitons for her health care, even though i had at the time 2 brothers, a sister, and a sil, and a bil. my mother had a brain anurisum, that burst, put her in a coma. the doctors told me every thing and after two weeks of going to see her. the doctors had finally told me she would never wake up, and if she did she would be a vegtable. i had then take her off life support and they put her in a wait to die room, she lived for another week and passed on. i was never sorry for my desicion, it was what was best for her. if, you can take care of your mother at home, i mean feed her, give her the meds, and see to her needs, then keep her home. if you can't, then find a hospice that will feed her through her feeding tube and take care of her the way you wish for her to be taken care of. i am very sorry you and your family are going through this. hopfully what i have said will help you some.