Has the President lost his mind ??????

[babymaniac]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3887721/

[bngomom]

No, the election is in November.

Following is a quote from the article:

By dangling the prospect of legal status to 8 million illegal immigrants now estimated to be in this country, about half of them Mexican, Bush was granting a top priority of the business community while making his most aggressive move yet to court Latino voters. He won just more than a third of that constituency in 2000 but wants to expand his support in the community to better his chances for re-election in November.

[MamaFairal]

LET the WHITE HOUSE employ them all........!.....
.......
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...














SORRY JMO!

[Sha]

Ok..this is meant to make the Bush NON-Supporters laugh. NO OFFENSE MEANT OK! I use these to p*ss of my father in law! LOL!

http://home.twcny.rr.com/felicity/nostradamus.jpg A Wonderful Collection of Bush Memoirs...LOL! (http://home.twcny.rr.com/felicity/george_bush_pictures.htm)

[nosamiam]

They are here and they might as well become tax payers just like the rest of us.

[MrsSpeed]

Originally posted by nosamiam
They are here and they might as well become tax payers just like the rest of us.

Yep!

[Gitty]

oh yeah make them citizens, maybe our jobs will comeback from across the boarder.

[okie]

I think we need to start worrying about our own people first.

[mesue]

Bush is wanting the latino vote 1 in every 10 voters are latino, also this will get him a lot of votes and support from the people who own businesses that makes their money off the backs of illegal immigrants, nothing that I know of has been said about bettering their living conditions and wages but my guess is if its brought up it won't get any legislation backing it. Also did any of you hear that the Department of Labor has begun helping employers learn how to keep from paying their employees overtime. I heard this on one of the news programs, not sure which one, will try and find a link about it.

[okie]

Originally posted by mesue
Bush is wanting the latino vote 1 in every 10 voters are latino, also this will get him a lot of votes and support from the people who own businesses that makes their money off the backs of illegal immigrants, nothing that I know of has been said about bettering their living conditions and wages but my guess is if its brought up it won't get any legislation backing it. Also did any of you hear that the Department of Labor has begun helping employers learn how to keep from paying their employees overtime. I heard this on one of the news programs, not sure which one, will try and find a link about it.

That doesn't surprise me.My husband works for the government and they were trying to pass a law where they wouldn't be paid for their overtime.I'm glad they didn't get that one passed because we live off of his overtime.

[mesue]

Okie you are not going to like this, neither will I or anyone else here, this is the link to the story I saw.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3882629/

[momfromTN]

Originally posted by mesue
Okie you are not going to like this, neither will I or anyone else here, this is the link to the story I saw.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3882629/

Now that DOES suck. And I am fully against that. And I will be letting that sentiment be known. Thank you for the link.

[Angeleyes03]

I am sorry you guys feel that way about the illegal immigrants coming over to work. There are some people who are hard workers and would like to come here and work, they do not have a chance over there. That is why they come to America. I am sorry, but there are some americans here that don't even work, and they have the (latinos)all imigrants in America are not Mexicans working in there place. JMO

[momfromTN]

Originally posted by Angeleyes03
I am sorry you guys feel that way about the illegal immigrants coming over to work. There are some people who are hard workers and would like to come here and work, they do not have a chance over there. That is why they come to America. I am sorry, but there are some americans here that don't even work, and they have the (latinos)all imigrants in America are not Mexicans working in there place. JMO

My husband, who could do ANY job in his plant and trained people, was laid off after being off for surgery, because his employer was getting rid of people who made a decent wage and giving the jobs to the local hispanics who had just moved in, and paying them less. But you are right, there are some Americans who won't work. But, should a person lose their job, to people who are unskilled for the job, so the employer can pay less? That is wrong.

[Angeleyes03]

NO, i am not saying they should lose there job, to give an immigrant a job. I am just saying that some don't and won't even try and work.

[DAVESBABYDOLL]

I was watching CNN and they were having a debate on this...the guy for it said....THE IMMIGRANTS DO THE JOBS THAT WE (citizens) WONT TAKE/DO

[okie]

Originally posted by mesue
Okie you are not going to like this, neither will I or anyone else here, this is the link to the story I saw.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3882629/

That totally sucks.

[schsa]

I understand that this is going to cause some problems. But as many as are out of work, there are just that many more who are working hard to get ahead. And they are already here so why not give them some sort of status so that we can collect taxes from them, we can account for them when a census is due, we can know who is in the country and who isn't. There are people from all over the world who come to this country and then just "disappear". They find jobs, get married, and have children. They spend their money here.

If you are here illegally and have been working here for 5 years, paying taxes, and trying to become a part of the community, why not make it legal? I would prefer that rather than having to spend the money to deport illegals all of the time we make them citizens or at least document them so that we know who is in this country.

[JENNIFERCATLADY]

What happened to all the laws regarding illegal aliens? I don't care if someone has been here for 20 years and they are illegal SEND 'EM BACK!!!! We need to take care of our own first! I am tired of working 50 + hours a week and barely surviving. I hear so many times "America's great, they give you your own store and hey I'm not even a legal resident of the U.S.". Hello?!?! Does anyone see the problem with this?? While I'm at it, if you want to live here then learn ENGLISH!!!! America is NOT a Spanish, French, Asian speaking country!!!!

[gemini26]

Agreed DBD and Shcsa. They do often take the jobs no one else wants. How many here know of someone or want to take the jobs they do? Long hot hours picking produce, taking the lowliest of jobs in meat plants or the like, etc, etc. Truth be know most people (I did not say all) think they are better than that. Look how many are willing to sit on their butts and take welfare rather than take a job at McDonanlds. I have lived in Ca, Az, and NM and people I run across think they are too good for certain jobs. THese illegals are already ehre doing these jobs no one else wants to do so why not make it so we get tax money from them. We might as well get something else besides labor.

[okie]

Originally posted by JENNIFERCATLADY
What happened to all the laws regarding illegal aliens? I don't care if someone has been here for 20 years and they are illegal SEND 'EM BACK!!!! We need to take care of our own first! I am tired of working 50 + hours a week and barely surviving. I hear so many times "America's great, they give you your own store and hey I'm not even a legal resident of the U.S.". Hello?!?! Does anyone see the problem with this?? While I'm at it, if you want to live here then learn ENGLISH!!!! America is NOT a Spanish, French, Asian speaking country!!!!

Hey,where's my store?
I see where your coming from and i agree.
They come over here and expect everything to be handed to them and they get it but we are the ones who are paying taxes and supporting them.I say get them out of here.They are illegal so they shouldn't be here in the first place.

[harloo]

Bush is not doing this for the good of the illegal immigrants, and every one know's that this is POLITICAL. He knows that his new immigration sham will be knocked down by both houses.

I am sick of Bush playing politics and fooling people into believing that he is some genuine do gooder when he is doing nothing but lying. In his proposal, after 3 years the immigrants will have to go home. They only get temporary status to work in this country. It's nothing but a plea for him to get reelected and I hope someone calls him on it. Even some of the leaders in the Latino community are skeptical about his new plan.

IMO, you should not play games with peoples emotions.

[Angeleyes03]

Originally posted by gemini26
Agreed DBD and Shcsa. They do often take the jobs no one else wants. How many here know of someone or want to take the jobs they do? Long hot hours picking produce, taking the lowliest of jobs in meat plants or the like, etc, etc. Truth be know most people (I did not say all) think they are better than that. Look how many are willing to sit on their butts and take welfare rather than take a job at McDonanlds. I have lived in Ca, Az, and NM and people I run across think they are too good for certain jobs. THese illegals are already ehre doing these jobs no one else wants to do so why not make it so we get tax money from them. We might as well get something else besides labor.

That is my point exactly!!!! And america might not be a Spanish, French, Asian speaking country. But why is it that americans want to learn spanish, french,asian and etc. And they would learn english if they had a chance too.

[babymaniac]

Just a few more thoughts... Why would any of us be expected to feel sympathy for felons .Illegal aliens have committed a felony .If Charles Manson makes a prison break tomorrow , is it acceptable for the government to give him free housing ,and food ,and an education ,and let him live tax free as well ? Of course not . Who would want an escaped felon roaming our streets???? Nobody. But that is exactly what we are expected to be ok with everyday .They should be collected and sent back .Period .The Country being on a code orange security alert is a joke.How are we safe when the government turns a blind eye to millions of illegals ? Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here .
When there is plenty of work for American citizens ,and there are no homeless American children ,and 30% of the Federal prison population is not made up of illegal immigrants ,I migh be able to find it in my heart to feel a bit more sympathy .

[Sha]

I am not really sure of my stance yet on this...I have a bad feeling about this. But I don't know if any of you watched the O'Reilly factor last night on PBS but one thing that bothered me and these we real statistics. They said that 35% of Illegal immigrants are on total support of welfare and 68% of them recieve some type of assistance that we as tax payers pay. I am married into a Mexican-Spanish family and we all sat and talked about this last night. It is not going to be a good thing. Especially here in california. We have old Gov.Dorkinator wanting to repeal SB 1419, the law that prevents schools from contracting-out services such as busing and maintenance. Bad thing is schools will then contract out to people who do NOT follow strict drug testing and go through background checks. So we may have some person say that is a low life from here or one from where ever else repairing our childrens buses, cleaning thier classrooms, and it just frieghtens me that they will have TOTAL access to our kids. They say it will help them, well what about us. I am soo confused! Ok...Sorry I will shut up now. ;)

[Angeleyes03]

Originally posted by babymaniac
Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here .



Okay i really don't think that is fair to say, my parents are mexicans and i know for dam sure that they wouldn't do anybodys dirty work especially that mans. They are citizens now they have been here in the U.S for years now. And they both work and pay taxes and all that stuff.

[babymaniac]

I am referring to the illegals .I have absolutely no problem with legal Mexicans .But I do think they should have to go through legal channels to become citizens here.Not be rewarded for breaking the law.And to let millions of illegals stay here is doing exactly that .

[Angeleyes03]

I understand what you mean, but lets not be so harsh. Anyways we will just have to wait and see what happens.I do not want to get all worked up about this subject, cause i come to this board and relax from the problems i do have. :)

[feliciac]

Originally posted by Angeleyes03
I am sorry you guys feel that way about the illegal immigrants coming over to work.

I really only want to point out one thing, they are ILLEGAL immigrants. If they want to be here, then they need to do it the right way. After living in southern CA and seeing what having to provide for the children of illegal immigrants does to health care and education, maybe more people would agree that the illegals either need to go home or get legal. Period, end of story. I hate to sound so harsh, but it's time we stop coddling everyone in the world and start taking care of our own, LEGAL, taxpaying citizens.

And I don't think employers should get off either. I think they should pay steep fines if they are caught employing illegals. They are circumventing the law and taking jobs away from people who need them and would do them if they paid the wages that are supposed to be paid.

But please remember, I am not out to offend anyone, these are only MY opinions. :)

[Sha]

Originally posted by feliciac
I really only want to point out one thing, they are ILLEGAL immigrants. If they want to be here, then they need to do it the right way. After living in southern CA and seeing what having to provide for the children of illegal immigrants does to health care and education, maybe more people would agree that the illegals either need to go home or get legal. Period, end of story. I hate to sound so harsh, but it's time we stop coddling everyone in the world and start taking care of our own, LEGAL, taxpaying citizens.



Feliciac, I know where you are coming from. I am here in Central CA...there are so many illegals and these poor kids suffer so much in our schools and take away from the other kids in the classroom simply because there is a shortage of Bilingual aides in CA (no more money) and the teacher has to help them more and our kids less. It's not the kids faults, it is our Governments..Sad but what can we do?

[momfromTN]

Originally posted by Sha
Feliciac, I know where you are coming from. I am here in Central CA...there are so many illegals and these poor kids suffer so much in our schools and take away from the other kids in the classroom simply because there is a shortage of Bilingual aides in CA (no more money) and the teacher has to help them more and our kids less. It's not the kids faults, it is our Governments..Sad but what can we do?

ITA! It is NOT our Government's Problem. It is the parent's doing and THEY need to take care of it.

[jen-ron]

Illegal aliens means just that, they are here AGAINST the law. If they are so hyped up on livin here, they need to do so leagally, go through the right channels. Yes, its a long process, as it was for my Mom who moved to England, took her 2-3 years to get a 6 year visa, not a citizinship, but she did it the LEGAL way. Its not right that we have to support some one who doesnt belong in our country. Now, I dont mean that they dont belong period, they just dont belong because they are here ILLEGALLY(again, against the law) The company I work for hires seaonal Mexican workers, they pay them $2-3 MORE an hour then me and they DONT have to pay taxes. Does that sound right to you?? I think not. And one of those lovely seasonal workers didnt know how to read damn english, didnt stop at a stop sign and slammed into the side of my car, totaling it and puttin my friend in the hospital cause they hit on her side of the car, so THATS why they HAVE to be able to speak English. You go to any other country in the world and you HAVE to speak their language to get anywhere, its should be the same here. Our national language is English, there for in public, it is the language you should speak, at home its whatever you wish. Thats my opionion.

[Sha]

Originally posted by momfromTN
ITA! It is NOT our Government's Problem. It is the parent's doing and THEY need to take care of it.

What I meant and I am sorry I was in a hurry when I posted, I meant it is our governments fault by letting these people use the system the way they do, I very much agree that it is the parents fault by not educating themselves or thier kids. I meant to express I think that our kids suffer by not getting the attention they need as English speaking citizens. Sorry I did not do a good job in my post! DOH! Still was so happy about me breaking my 500 posts! LOL!

[JENNIFERCATLADY]

Illegal aliens means just that, they are here AGAINST the law. If they are so hyped up on livin here, they need to do so leagally, go through the right channels. Yes, its a long process, as it was for my Mom who moved to England, took her 2-3 years to get a 6 year visa, not a citizinship, but she did it the LEGAL way. Its not right that we have to support some one who doesnt belong in our country. Now, I dont mean that they dont belong period, they just dont belong because they are here ILLEGALLY(again, against the law) The company I work for hires seaonal Mexican workers, they pay them $2-3 MORE an hour then me and they DONT have to pay taxes. Does that sound right to you?? I think not. And one of those lovely seasonal workers didnt know how to read damn english, didnt stop at a stop sign and slammed into the side of my car, totaling it and puttin my friend in the hospital cause they hit on her side of the car, so THATS why they HAVE to be able to speak English. You go to any other country in the world and you HAVE to speak their language to get anywhere, its should be the same here. Our national language is English, there for in public, it is the language you should speak, at home its whatever you wish. Thats my opionion.

Jen-Ron to the rescue!!! I couldn't say it better myself!!!!

[DBackFan]

I had to go to court today with my son and I couldn't believe it. Court was at 1:00 PM so we are there on time and seated in the courtroom. A Bailiff comes in and starts a video? It is all about how to plead etc etc (this is traffic court..lol) After 15 LONG boring minutes it ended and we think court will start...WRONG! The video started OVER in Spanish!! We had to sit through another 15 minutes!! I was pissed. They could have at least subtitled the english one with Spanish or something. Talk about WRONG! :mad:

[JENNIFERCATLADY]

That's nuts DBack!!!! That why I say SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! If you don't know English, you should have 2 choices 1.) Learn it!!! 2.) Go home!!! Either one will work just fine for me!!!

[okie]

Originally posted by JENNIFERCATLADY
That's nuts DBack!!!! That why I say SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! If you don't know English, you should have 2 choices 1.) Learn it!!! 2.) Go home!!! Either one will work just fine for me!!!

LOL

ITA

[JKATHERINE]

Originally posted by JENNIFERCATLADY
What happened to all the laws regarding illegal aliens? I don't care if someone has been here for 20 years and they are illegal SEND 'EM BACK!!!! We need to take care of our own first! I am tired of working 50 + hours a week and barely surviving. I hear so many times "America's great, they give you your own store and hey I'm not even a legal resident of the U.S.". Hello?!?! Does anyone see the problem with this?? While I'm at it, if you want to live here then learn ENGLISH!!!! America is NOT a Spanish, French, Asian speaking country!!!!





I agree with you, Jennifer. Also,as my husband pointed out to me, has anyone even thought about those poor men and women who work at our borders to try and keep these immigrants out? These people often risk their lives going after these people trying to sneak into our country. So then we go and give them legal status??!! What a slap in the face to the border patrol! And what kind of message are we sending to the illegal immigrants? "It's okay to break the law, we'll just reward you for it?" Something is WRONG with this picture.

[DBackFan]

Originally posted by JENNIFERCATLADY
That's nuts DBack!!!! That why I say SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! If you don't know English, you should have 2 choices 1.) Learn it!!! 2.) Go home!!! Either one will work just fine for me!!!

I feel the same way..lol. I travel to Mexico a LOT but I would NEVER EXPECT someone there to speak my language, it is MY problem just as it should be THEIR'S here.

[schsa]

Whoa! Many people who come to this country and stay illegally are not Hispanic. We have people who come here from all over the world and just drop out once they are here. That's part of the problem we had with the attack on the Twin Towers. Most of those involved, came to this country and just dropped out of sight. We as a nation had no way of knowing who was here and who wasn't. Just because the Hispanic population is the most visible doesn't mean that they aren't here legally or otherwise.

Next, yes, they don't speak English as a primary language. Where do you think Chinatown, and Little Italy came from? These were neighborhoods that developed because people who could not speak English graviated to neighborhoods where others did. But a few generations later, most people who arrived are now speaking English as a primary language. It will happen with everyone who comes to this county. Don't you think that language is a major barrier in getting the better jobs in this country? That's why these people come here and they take the jobs that no one else will. They know that they have a language problem. English is not the easiest language to learn and when you come from a village somewhere in the hills of Mexico there probably isn't an abundance of English teachers, let alone any sort of teachers.

Yes, it is hard, but the best part is that as they become part of the bigger picture, they will become American citizens and their children will be born English speaking and American citizens, the same way it happened with everyone who arrived at Ellis Island.

[harloo]

Latino's have the highest growth base of illegal immigrants in the US, and the President knows it and wants to capitalize on that fact.
Let's be honest, regardless of how American citizens are generous we cannot continue to allow everyone too come into this country and use public services, and accomodate coporate america's plea's for cheap uninsured workers.

With the economy in the toilets, and the war going on in Iraq it's becoming impossible. Good citizens are being laid off for cheaper workers, especially in the tech and manufacturing industries.

I don't understand why people continue too support Bush if he turns his head and looks the other way when middle class families are being affected the most.

I don't have a problem with someone wanting to come to this country, but if you want to become a U.S. citizen, go through the process. If you go to any other country you bet that you will have to go through a process before you recieve any public benefits.

[babymaniac]

Originally posted by schsa


Next, yes, they don't speak English as a primary language. Where do you think Chinatown, and Little Italy came from? These were neighborhoods that developed because people who could not speak English graviated to neighborhoods where others did. But a few generations later, most people who arrived are now speaking English as a primary language. It will happen with everyone who comes to this county. Don't you think that language is a major barrier in getting the better jobs in this country? That's why these people come here and they take the jobs that no one else will. They know that they have a language problem. English is not the easiest language to learn and when you come from a village somewhere in the hills of Mexico there probably isn't an abundance of English teachers, let alone any sort of teachers.



The thing is ,our government and a lot of our industries are kissing the behinds of the illegal Mexican immigrants.Sure we have illegals from all different countries .But at the same time ,our children our not expected to sit in class over an hour each week being taught , Chinese ,Arabic etc...But they are being taught Spanish. Were the parents asked about this ? If it is everywhere as it is in my school system , then no, We were not asked.And I am amazed that schools have the money for these nice Spanish lessons when our music programs are being taken away ,classrooms are crowded because of lack of teachers and one of our schools has it's Special Education class in an old janitor's closet.Sorry,but in a few generations our children will be speaking fluent Spanish ,not the other way around.
Wal-mart has every sign in English and Spanish .I cannot but anything from diapers to shampoo anymore that does not have all the instructions in English as well as Spanish .Maybe some nice Chinese illegal who doesn't speak English ,would like to know how quilted and absorbant the toilet paper she is buying is .But she is out of luck.Come here from any other country and you had better learn English .Sneak in from Mexico and we will put you in a nice place to live , feed you ,take care of your medical bills and educate your kids.All of this should keep you pretty busy while we scurry to learn Spanish so we can speak to you and make you feel even more at home.

[so-bee-it]

Originaly posted by babymaniac:

"Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here."



Have been a "lurker" here for awhile, but I knew I had to come out of that mode when I saw this thread.
I am a hardworking and intelligent latina who is fluent in 5 languages, and yes one of them is SPANISH. I own my interior decorating business and live a very comfortable life. Believe me, I didn't get to this point by expecting anything from anybody. It all happened with hard work! While I can truly agree with some of the comments here, there is the above one that made me come out of "lurker mode." First to let you know "babymaniac" that sadly your remark says alot about the kind of person you are and most important I can guarantee you there is NOT one mexican illegal or legal that would even SPIT on
Osama!!! Muchless do his dirty work!!! I'm not here to argue back and forth with you. My time is too valuable for all that. I'm simply here to speak my peace just like you did so many times regarding this subject. I do wonder if you would have the guts to go up to a latino/latina and make your "Osama" remark to their face...for your own safety I would not suggest it, keep on doing what you do best, hiding behind your PC!!!

[KYgirl]

Originally posted by so-bee-it
Originaly posted by babymaniac:

"Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here."



Have been a "lurker" here for awhile, but I knew I had to come out of that mode when I saw this thread.
I am a hardworking and intelligent latina who is fluent in 5 languages, and yes one of them is SPANISH. I own my interior decorating business and live a very comfortable life. Believe me, I didn't get to this point by expecting anything from anybody. It all happened with hard work! While I can truly agree with some of the comments here, there is the above one that made me come out of "lurker mode." First to let you know "babymaniac" that sadly your remark says alot about the kind of person you are and most important I can guarantee you there is NOT one mexican illegal or legal that would even SPIT on
Osama!!! Muchless do his dirty work!!! I'm not here to argue back and forth with you. My time is too valuable for all that. I'm simply here to speak my peace just like you did so many times regarding this subject. I do wonder if you would have the guts to go up to a latino/latina and make your "Osama" remark to their face...for your own safety I would not suggest it, keep on doing what you do best, hiding behind your PC!!!



<Cheering>

EXCELLENT POST "so-bee-it" :D :D

[silvermist]

Immigrants aren't taking ANYTHING from America. What are they doing coming over here and attacking us and stealing our jobs and mugging us of all things? lol Reality flash no they aren't. The truth be told is they're willing to work HARDER for less money. I'm not going to complain about immigrants stealing jobs. Instead I'll work all the harder. If they're gonna work might as well let em pay for taxes as well all LEGALLY. Anyway all this is is a lil competition. Don't want to get your job taken by "immigrants"? Work a little harder is all I have to say about it. If those not willing to work harder and complain about jobs being stolen maybe it's those people who doesn't deserve to live in America. Not immigrants who are willing to work just as hard.

[babymaniac]

Originally posted by so-bee-it




I am a hardworking and intelligent latina who is fluent in 5 languages, and yes one of them is SPANISH. I own my interior decorating business and live a very comfortable life. Believe me, I didn't get to this point by expecting anything from anybody. It all happened with hard work! While I can truly agree with some of the comments here, there is the above one that made me come out of "lurker mode." First to let you know "babymaniac" that sadly your remark says alot about the kind of person you are and most important I can guarantee you there is NOT one mexican illegal or legal that would even SPIT on
Osama!!! Muchless do his dirty work!!! I'm not here to argue back and forth with you. My time is too valuable for all that. I'm simply here to speak my peace just like you did so many times regarding this subject. I do wonder if you would have the guts to go up to a latino/latina and make your "Osama" remark to their face...for your own safety I would not suggest it, keep on doing what you do best, hiding behind your PC!!!

I am glad you work hard and speak English. .It sets a nice example that I wish others would follow. As far as making the Osama comment to an illegal's face , I would gladly do that . The sad part is , they would not understand a word I say as they refuse to learn English .I am not a mean person .But I do love my America and I think the president has lost his mind.That is just my opinion and it is a fair one . :) Have a nice day.

[silvermist]

Originally posted by so-bee-it
Originaly posted by babymaniac:

"Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here."



Have been a "lurker" here for awhile, but I knew I had to come out of that mode when I saw this thread.
I am a hardworking and intelligent latina who is fluent in 5 languages, and yes one of them is SPANISH. I own my interior decorating business and live a very comfortable life. Believe me, I didn't get to this point by expecting anything from anybody. It all happened with hard work! While I can truly agree with some of the comments here, there is the above one that made me come out of "lurker mode." First to let you know "babymaniac" that sadly your remark says alot about the kind of person you are and most important I can guarantee you there is NOT one mexican illegal or legal that would even SPIT on
Osama!!! Muchless do his dirty work!!! I'm not here to argue back and forth with you. My time is too valuable for all that. I'm simply here to speak my peace just like you did so many times regarding this subject. I do wonder if you would have the guts to go up to a latino/latina and make your "Osama" remark to their face...for your own safety I would not suggest it, keep on doing what you do best, hiding behind your PC!!!

Good for you! I fully agree. I can't understand some people's ignorant, racist comments. Stereotyping. If you're going to argue, do it intelligently.

And the thing about Spanish being taught in schools. In most schools there are OTHER options such as French, etc. Spanish just happens to be the second most useful language in the USA. I don't get whoever posted that tangent about Spanish being taugh in schools and how thathad to do with the government kissing their a**? And no I'm not Spanish or anything. I just hate it when people complain about being "mugged and robbed" of their jobs. Want it? Work harder. Cuz you're not being robbed of anything. Want a farming job? Go right ahead and see what a REAL day of hard toil is like..

[jackfrost]

great opinions so be it and silvermist i agree
do you think these realy want to break the law by coming here,to work a crap job,get paid pennies,not understand the english launguage?they come here because this is America most of us came from immagrants
all they want is to work and have a better life for their familys

[moogle]

There's a big difference between immigrants and illegal aliens.
Immigrants are here legally, paying taxes like the rest of us.
Illegal aliens don't.

[babymaniac]

My daughter was not given the option of taking French until high school. My 9 year old has to take Spanish as does my 6 year old step-daughter.They are not given a choice.By the way , my step daughter is half-Mexican ,so to call me a racist is crap.
You are right about how hard farm work is . I know because my husband and I own a farm .We raise tobacco and cattle.Lots of local people come to us for work .Most have lost their factory jobs. They work their tails off from dawn 'till dusk.They are Americans ,not illegals.So I can say first hand that all illegals are not doing work that Americans will not.

[ckerr4]

Originally posted by babymaniac
I am glad you work hard and speak English. It sets a nice example that I wish others would follow. As far as making the Osama comment to an illegal's face , I would gladly do that . The sad part is , they would not understand a word I say as they refuse to learn English . I am not a mean person .But I do love my America and I think the president has lost his mind.That is just my opinion and it is a fair one . :) Have a nice day.

But whether you are mean or nice, people will continue to argue, and call you racist, regardless of who is in your family (per your later post) as long as you make statements like this.

There are many many immigrants, legal and legal, who would understand much of what you would say to them. Immigrants understand a great deal more English than that for which you are giving them credit. As for refusing to learn English? Hardly. Are immigrants in language classes all day? Lol, no. They have families to support, the same as you and I. But they are learning English, on the job, at their churches, in the community, from their kids. I've never talked to an immigrant, legal or illegal who didn't make an effort to talk to me in English. And in return, I use what Spanish I know. We fill in the rest with gestures and expressions.

There is a misunderstanding about how the ESL and bilingual education systems work. Understand that there is a difference between one language class, which surely is not detrimental to a child's education, no matter which language class it is, and instruction in another language all day long.

Now, as for the President's mind...I'll not say he ever had a grip, lol. And I'll not even agree that this is a good solution. But something has to be done. Ignoring the problem won't make it go away. Pretending illegal immigrants aren't here won't solve the crisis. And acting as if they aren't humans, and productive members, in most cases, of the community (if we would let them be) is so far beyond compassion that it should be alien to us as individuals and as a nation.

[stresseater]

And I'll not even agree that this is a good solution. But something has to be done. Ignoring the problem won't make it go away.
We could send them home and work out a better system for keeping illegals out of the country.

"Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here."
I can almost get this. Are you trying to say that allowing whomever can run the fastest to come into the country is a big security risk? If so I will agree with that.

There is a misunderstanding about how the ESL and bilingual education systems work. Understand that there is a difference between one language class, which surely is not detrimental to a child's education, no matter which language class it is, and instr
In Oklahoma City schiils they start forcing spanish on them from Kindergarten. This is wrong!!!!!!! We live in America and the primary(although not offically) language is English,one of the hardest languages to learn. While young kids are trying to learn english I don't think we should confuse them with other languages. Geeeze let them get our language down first and then IF they want to learn another language more power to them.:D :D :D

[ckerr4]

They probably start teaching a foreign langauge at such an early age because educational studies have shown that kids who begin learning another language that early learn it more easily and retain it better. It doesn't harm the acqusition and retention of the primary language, and it isn't done in subversion of primary language acquisition. It should, if done properly, actually help language development, and academic skills in general. It's a good thing. I can't imagine not wanting my child to know another langauge. Other countries in the world teach secondary langauges from the moment kids enter school. Its academic, not political. When we make it political, we harm our children academically. The longer we wait to introduce a foreign language, the more difficult it is to learn.

[mesue]

I don't know if this is just some way to get the legal latino votes or get us all off on this subject while something else goes down in Washington that they really would prefer we not focus on, that has been the way this president has worked from the beginning, sometimes I feel lke the American public is just like a bunch of puppets to be manipulated by the Bush administration.

[momfromTN]

Originally posted by mesue
I don't know if this is just some way to get the legal latino votes or get us all off on this subject while something else goes down in Washington that they really would prefer we not focus on, that has been the way this president has worked from the beginning, sometimes I feel lke the American public is just like a bunch of puppets to be manipulated by the Bush administration.

I beg your pardon? You consider yourself a puppet? I hope not. You and I don't agree on these things, but you are a smart person and no puppet. I know I am not. I am not easily manipulated either. But, I know what you are saying since I was vehemently opposed to the 8 yrs of the Clinton era. But, that is another subject.

[matt111]

the pres want the hispanic vote he knows it will NEVER pass congress

[zitra]

Originally posted by ckerr4
But whether you are mean or nice, people will continue to argue, and call you racist, regardless of who is in your family (per your later post) as long as you make statements like this.

There are many many immigrants, legal and legal, who would understand much of what you would say to them. Immigrants understand a great deal more English than that for which you are giving them credit. As for refusing to learn English? Hardly. Are immigrants in language classes all day? Lol, no. They have families to support, the same as you and I. But they are learning English, on the job, at their churches, in the community, from their kids. I've never talked to an immigrant, legal or illegal who didn't make an effort to talk to me in English. And in return, I use what Spanish I know. We fill in the rest with gestures and expressions.

There is a misunderstanding about how the ESL and bilingual education systems work. Understand that there is a difference between one language class, which surely is not detrimental to a child's education, no matter which language class it is, and instruction in another language all day long.

Now, as for the President's mind...I'll not say he ever had a grip, lol. And I'll not even agree that this is a good solution. But something has to be done. Ignoring the problem won't make it go away. Pretending illegal immigrants aren't here won't solve the crisis. And acting as if they aren't humans, and productive members, in most cases, of the community (if we would let them be) is so far beyond compassion that it should be alien to us as individuals and as a nation.

agree fully

[mesue]

Originally posted by momfromTN
I beg your pardon? You consider yourself a puppet? I hope not. You and I don't agree on these things, but you are a smart person and no puppet. I know I am not. I am not easily manipulated either. But, I know what you are saying since I was vehemently opposed to the 8 yrs of the Clinton era. But, that is another subject.


No, I do not consider myself a puppet because I do not believe most of the BS that the Bush administrations tells nor excuse everything they do. I did not believe the scare tactics they used to convince people that we should go into Iraq, you know those weapons of mass destruction they are still looking for and the attack from Iraq of chemical war, you know lets us attack first before we get attacked. I'm not saying that Saddam was ever a good guy or that I have 1 oz. of sympathy for him but at the time we invaded Iraq he was less of a threat to us than he had ever been. As for the invasion of Iraq to save those poor people that was never the intent, nor was it seeking retribution for 9/11 there was not one shred of evidence he was involved in that; it was oil and payback for Big Daddy who should have finished the job in the first place when we had the backing of the UN. Bush has went into office with no deposit we now have a deposit of billions heck maybe trillions, heck he had money in the bank remember all that tax money he returned to us. Yes I know 9/11 happened and we went into Afghanistan looking for the culprits and yeah that costed money then there is Iraq,we should never have went in without UN support, now we are footing the bill for most of it if not all of it. Then there is the Patriot Act which actually takes rights away from you and me, oh yes that is a good response to terrorism take rights away from Americans. Then there is the economy as far as jobs goes, Bush has been screaming how we are in an economic recovery 100,000 jobs a month lost since he has been in office and this big economic recovery 1000 jobs were created recently, wow. Oh and to add to the mounting debt lets go to the moon and Mars. Clinton lied about fooling around, Big Deal it was nobody's buisness about his sex life, we paid through the nose for that investigation, and guess what no charges and he was not impeached. What was so bad for you under the Clinton Administration? Most people I know would tell you they were better off financially then than now. You may think I would never vote for a republican I have in the past when I thought that person was the better person for the job, so I am not strictly a democrat, what I want is a President who knows that the little guy who doesn't make a lot of money low income to middle class are the backbone of America their tax dollars and hard work supports this country, not the rich mans they look for loopholes, the low income and the middle class they are patriotic enough to feel they owe those taxes. I want a president who knows that our sons and daughters are as valuable to us as his are to him, and thinks long and hard before he would ever consider sending them off to war, looks for every reasonable way to fix a situation without sending our children to war and you notice I said ours not his, when it comes to making the sacrifices its always the low income and the middle class who makes those sacrifices, did you know that under the patriot act your childs school has to turn over your phone number and address to recruiters, did you know that is written into the patriot act if a school does not they risk losing federal funding. Before it became law it was commone practice anyway and that includes under all the previous administrations. Now I am familiar with this list as I questioned a recruiter who made the mistake of calling to speak to my 14 year old daughter, I questioned him on where he got my children's name and phone number and he replied that he got it from school and that he also got thier test results, I educated him on why he should never call my house again. I then called the guidance counselor and asked about the list, she was well aware of what list I was speaking of and replied yes they gave recruiters a list, when I asked if my daughter's entire class of approximately 300 was on that list and she said No, when I asked how they decided who to put on the list she said it was the ones that parents probably could not afford to send them to college and she did not understand why I would tell her to never ever put my children on her list again , I then asked her if hers was on the list she replied NO and that my children would not be on the list again. I then called the Principal and the superintendant of schools who said it was standard practice in every school they knew of. My point for telling you this is to let you know that the middle class and low income are targeted for recruitment, not the President or the Senators or the rich people's children, before a parent could if they were aware take their childs name off the list I doubt if they can now since it is law that schools has to provide this info. Now MomfromTn I think you are smart too and since I have told you some of the reasons why I see Bush as a bad President please tell me why you see him as a good one. Oh and one more thing please don't tell me his brilliant leadersip during 9/11, all he did was make a few speeches about how we are Americans and will pull through this, no maybe I missed something by all means tell me about it. Oh and lets not forget the free speech zones (Bush has always done this to his protesters putting them blocks and blocks away from himself and supporters), now MomfromTN do you not agree that this is America and that every single inch of soil here should be a free speech zone.

[harloo]

Originally posted by mesue
I don't know if this is just some way to get the legal latino votes or get us all off on this subject while something else goes down in Washington that they really would prefer we not focus on, that has been the way this president has worked from the beginning, sometimes I feel lke the American public is just like a bunch of puppets to be manipulated by the Bush administration.

Exactly, the problem is not the presentation itself it's simply the motive behind the President's actions. The Republican Party has always been against illegal immigration, and that's no big secret. However, now since Bush knows that the latino community might give him that edge in his reelection he all of the sudden proposes this bill. Is it coincidental that he came up with this proposal during an election year?

I'm pretty sure what Bush hopes too happen is that this proposal gets to one of the houses and is defeated.Then he can blame the defeat on the congress or senate. Look at the proposal. It gives illegal workers a temporary work visa, and after 3 years they will be encouraged to go home. Bush made it clear that they will not recieve any special advantage when filing for legal status. So what is the purpose of the bill? They will still have to go through the process of becoming legal citizens. Well if someone is already living and working in this country then how would this benefit them?

[momfromTN]

There are many reasons why I think Bush is a good leader. I have posted many of them here. The leadership during 9/11 SHOULD count, because it was a pivitol time in his administration. I also think that he would be proud if his daughters decided to serve in the Armed Forces. I also think the war was necessary for a lot of reasons. If you join the military, as your son in law did, then you take that chance that you will be called upon to do your job. I have no problem with recruiters calling my sons when they are older (they are small children). If my sons decided to serve, I would be proud. Worried like any mom, but proud. But, that would be unlikely, since my younger son is special ed and the older one goes to a Christian School that does not take Federal Funding.

Why is it that Clinton's having that intern perform a sex act in the oval office and they LYING UNDER OATH about it, is no big deal to you? If you or I lied under oath, we would have been jailed. Also, I think that 9/11 is partially the fault of Clinton. If he hadn't dwindled the military by closing bases, and if he hadn't pared down our FBI/Intelligence, maybe we would have not been caught with our pants down. And what about that Naval Vessel that got bombed? I cannot recall the name right now, but I am sure you will remember.

Mesue, I just will quit here. I am tired of debating over why Bush is not the devil incarnate. Maybe later I will pick it back up. All I can say, to everyone, is VOTE.

[Angelseyes28]

Originally posted by momfromTN
Why is it that Clinton's having that intern perform a sex act in the oval office and they LYING UNDER OATH about it, is no big deal to you?

Clinton lied but no one died.(Thanks to the op that quoted that off of a bumper sticker a while back:))

[mesue]

Originally posted by momfromTN
There are many reasons why I think Bush is a good leader. I have posted many of them here. The leadership during 9/11 SHOULD count, because it was a pivitol time in his administration. I also think that he would be proud if his daughters decided to serve in the Armed Forces. I also think the war was necessary for a lot of reasons. If you join the military, as your son in law did, then you take that chance that you will be called upon to do your job. I have no problem with recruiters calling my sons when they are older (they are small children). If my sons decided to serve, I would be proud. Worried like any mom, but proud. But, that would be unlikely, since my younger son is special ed and the older one goes to a Christian School that does not take Federal Funding.

Why is it that Clinton's having that intern perform a sex act in the oval office and they LYING UNDER OATH about it, is no big deal to you? If you or I lied under oath, we would have been jailed. Also, I think that 9/11 is partially the fault of Clinton. If he hadn't dwindled the military by closing bases, and if he hadn't pared down our FBI/Intelligence, maybe we would have not been caught with our pants down. And what about that Naval Vessel that got bombed? I cannot recall the name right now, but I am sure you will remember.

Mesue, I just will quit here. I am tired of debating over why Bush is not the devil incarnate. Maybe later I will pick it back up. All I can say, to everyone, is VOTE.


Well first let me say that my hubby is a former marine, son is former army, I made my son promise he would not join the marines I forgot to make him promise the rest so he found a loophole and joined the army little stinker. Anyway they sent him back to me with busted up feet and shins the idiots accepted him with the flattest feet imaginable ( Just in case anyone would assume he gets a check for all the damage they did to his body, No he does not get a check for this and is not expecting one from anyone) and so one week from getting through bootcamp 6th in his group, it was the DI who seen those back and blue feet and ankles and sent him to the dr. who sent him home on a medical discharge much to my son's disappointment. So believe me when I tell you they lie to you to get you to join, hubby laughs about all the ones he was told, son agreed he was lied to also but also knew they were lying from talks with other people an his Dad. I do not think it is right for anyone to call and influence your child at any age without your consent, I do not think that these people should go and have lunch with your children at school either. I do not think it is alright for military personnel to have access to your children on a personal level and by that I mean they are talking to them as early as middle school about joining the military. At any rate its just not the fact that my SIL is in Iraq he will be home soon, its the fact that we are still paying for it not just in dollars but lives that no amount of money can bring back. And if Bush lied about our reason for going there, if he indeed manipulated to get us there for any other reason than immediate national threat then to me he stole those lives. He is responsible for their loss. Now I agree with you Clinton should not have lied to us under oath but you should also note that there was a group of people going after him for anything and everything they could get him on and thats the best they could do and the courts agreed with him so its a mute point apparently though we all say and think he lied the courts do not. As for the President fooling around with an intern well she was over 18 and a consenting adult it was nobody's buisness but his and hers and Hilary's as far as I'm concerned. Heck even as much as I dislike Bush's as a President it is none of anybody's buisness what his sex life is as long as its between consenting adults. Clinton did cut military bases but he did not cut FBI or police as a matter of fact he increased their numbers. The Bush administration had adequate warning that something was coming, from the Clinton administration, other countries, an actor who observed 4 men on a plane looking at and through things they should not have, it was so blatent that they were up to something the actor went and informed the airline personell and then talked to security and then I think FBI as it turned out two of those men were two of the terorists on 911, but all this was ignored, thats why we were caught with our pants down its because nobody had sense enough to pull em up.

[Suz*e*]

Originally posted by JKATHERINE
I agree with you, Jennifer. Also,as my husband pointed out to me, has anyone even thought about those poor men and women who work at our borders to try and keep these immigrants out? These people often risk their lives going after these people trying to sneak into our country. So then we go and give them legal status??!! What a slap in the face to the border patrol! And what kind of message are we sending to the illegal immigrants? "It's okay to break the law, we'll just reward you for it?" Something is WRONG with this picture.


Originally posted by harloo
Latino's have the highest growth base of illegal immigrants in the US, and the President knows it and wants to capitalize on that fact.
Let's be honest, regardless of how American citizens are generous we cannot continue to allow everyone too come into this country and use public services, and accomodate coporate america's plea's for cheap uninsured workers.

With the economy in the toilets, and the war going on in Iraq it's becoming impossible. Good citizens are being laid off for cheaper workers, especially in the tech and manufacturing industries.

I don't understand why people continue too support Bush if he turns his head and looks the other way when middle class families are being affected the most.

I don't have a problem with someone wanting to come to this country, but if you want to become a U.S. citizen, go through the process. If you go to any other country you bet that you will have to go through a process before you recieve any public benefits.


Originally posted by mesue
Bush is wanting the latino vote 1 in every 10 voters are latino, also this will get him a lot of votes and support from the people who own businesses that makes their money off the backs of illegal immigrants, nothing that I know of has been said about bettering their living conditions and wages but my guess is if its brought up it won't get any legislation backing it. Also did any of you hear that the Department of Labor has begun helping employers learn how to keep from paying their employees overtime. I heard this on one of the news programs, not sure which one, will try and find a link about it.



Originally posted by harloo
Bush is not doing this for the good of the illegal immigrants, and every one know's that this is POLITICAL. He knows that his new immigration sham will be knocked down by both houses.

I am sick of Bush playing politics and fooling people into believing that he is some genuine do gooder when he is doing nothing but lying. In his proposal, after 3 years the immigrants will have to go home. They only get temporary status to work in this country. It's nothing but a plea for him to get reelected and I hope someone calls him on it. Even some of the leaders in the Latino community are skeptical about his new plan.

IMO, you should not play games with peoples emotions.



Originally posted by momfromTN
My husband, who could do ANY job in his plant and trained people, was laid off after being off for surgery, because his employer was getting rid of people who made a decent wage and giving the jobs to the local hispanics who had just moved in, and paying them less. But you are right, there are some Americans who won't work. But, should a person lose their job, to people who are unskilled for the job, so the employer can pay less? That is wrong.



Originally posted by JENNIFERCATLADY
What happened to all the laws regarding illegal aliens? I don't care if someone has been here for 20 years and they are illegal SEND 'EM BACK!!!! We need to take care of our own first! I am tired of working 50 + hours a week and barely surviving. I hear so many times "America's great, they give you your own store and hey I'm not even a legal resident of the U.S.". Hello?!?! Does anyone see the problem with this?? While I'm at it, if you want to live here then learn ENGLISH!!!! America is NOT a Spanish, French, Asian speaking country!!!!


Originally posted by babymaniac
Just a few more thoughts... Why would any of us be expected to feel sympathy for felons .Illegal aliens have committed a felony .If Charles Manson makes a prison break tomorrow , is it acceptable for the government to give him free housing ,and food ,and an education ,and let him live tax free as well ? Of course not . Who would want an escaped felon roaming our streets???? Nobody. But that is exactly what we are expected to be ok with everyday .They should be collected and sent back .Period .The Country being on a code orange security alert is a joke.How are we safe when the government turns a blind eye to millions of illegals ? Osama should really consider hiring Mexicans to do his dirty work since they are allowed to roam free here .
When there is plenty of work for American citizens ,and there are no homeless American children ,and 30% of the Federal prison population is not made up of illegal immigrants ,I migh be able to find it in my heart to feel a bit more sympathy .


Originally posted by feliciac
I really only want to point out one thing, they are ILLEGAL immigrants. If they want to be here, then they need to do it the right way. After living in southern CA and seeing what having to provide for the children of illegal immigrants does to health care and education, maybe more people would agree that the illegals either need to go home or get legal. Period, end of story. I hate to sound so harsh, but it's time we stop coddling everyone in the world and start taking care of our own, LEGAL, taxpaying citizens.

And I don't think employers should get off either. I think they should pay steep fines if they are caught employing illegals. They are circumventing the law and taking jobs away from people who need them and would do them if they paid the wages that are supposed to be paid.

But please remember, I am not out to offend anyone, these are only MY opinions. :)



Agree Completely!

This is VERY disturbing as I am a Republican, I will go down in flames before I vote for Bush again after this nonsense. It is time for me to put America before a political party preference.

[BigLyd1]

I must say that I'm also a Republican and Bush supporter, but after this, I just don't know anymore. In California, some have called Bush-Davis because Davis wanted to do the same thing here.

[Mom2B&L]

I don't normally post to political discussions but this one, and some of the comments, really upsets me. General AMERICAN history tells us that unless we are of Native American Descent we are all "foreigners" of some sort. The United States was built on the beliefs that everyone, EVERYONE, deserves a fair chance at LIFE, LIBERTY, AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS. I know the "lets take care of our own" attitude would lead one to believe that illegal aliens don't belong and should be sent back but that type of attitude is the same that says I refuse to work 8 hrs a day for minimum wage. Many immigrants, whether legal or illegal, are willing to work jobs that many native born Americans consider worthless. This type of perserverance, dedication, and want for a better life is what makes many immigrants very hard workers. They, unlike many of us, have been paid monthly what many of us make in a couple of days. I still believe there should be a screening process for immigration and citizenship but I also think we should REMEMBER WHERE OUR ROOTS CAME FROM and give everyone a chance to earn their keep. I am a native born American but my great grandfather came from Germany. I am sure he was also considered an "alien" when he entered the country. Take a long look in the mirror and ask yourself if you want your children to see the example you are setting. It is my opinion that everyone deserves a chance for a decent, honest life. IF that means leaving their home country and coming here, then so be it. This way, they pay taxes, contribute to the society they live in, and hopefully become Americans.

[Donnagg123]

Originally posted by babymaniac
By the way , my step daughter is half-Mexican ,so to call me a racist is crap.

I am sorry, but just because you happen to have a step daughter who is half Mexican does not exclude you from being called a racist for a statement that you make. That is the same as if I were to say that I have black friends so I can call any black person the N word or make derogitory statements about them because I am out of the boundaries of being racist.

[zitra]

Originally posted by Mom2B&L
I don't normally post to political discussions but this one, and some of the comments, really upsets me. General AMERICAN history tells us that unless we are of Native American Descent we are all "foreigners" of some sort. The United States was built on the beliefs that everyone, EVERYONE, deserves a fair chance at LIFE, LIBERTY, AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS. I know the "lets take care of our own" attitude would lead one to believe that illegal aliens don't belong and should be sent back but that type of attitude is the same that says I refuse to work 8 hrs a day for minimum wage. Many immigrants, whether legal or illegal, are willing to work jobs that many native born Americans consider worthless. This type of perserverance, dedication, and want for a better life is what makes many immigrants very hard workers. They, unlike many of us, have been paid monthly what many of us make in a couple of days. I still believe there should be a screening process for immigration and citizenship but I also think we should REMEMBER WHERE OUR ROOTS CAME FROM and give everyone a chance to earn their keep. I am a native born American but my great grandfather came from Germany. I am sure he was also considered an "alien" when he entered the country. Take a long look in the mirror and ask yourself if you want your children to see the example you are setting. It is my opinion that everyone deserves a chance for a decent, honest life. IF that means leaving their home country and coming here, then so be it. This way, they pay taxes, contribute to the society they live in, and hopefully become Americans.

ITA with you..I myself have grandparents on both sides that came over from Ireland, as well as English and Welsh relatives, and except for the small part of Native Americna thrown into the mix..ALL of my relatives were immigrants (including the English~they were not born here, and therefore were immigrants)..IMO EVERYONE except thos ewho are full blooded Native Americans are descended from immigrants..

[babymaniac]

Originally posted by Donnagg123
I am sorry, but just because you happen to have a step daughter who is half Mexican does not exclude you from being called a racist for a statement that you make. That is the same as if I were to say that I have black friends so I can call any black person the N word or make derogitory statements about them because I am out of the boundaries of being racist.

No,that alone does not mean that I am not a racist .But just because the thought of MILLIONS of illegals being here and the fact that Bush wants to pat them on the a**, makes me want to puke , does not make me a racist either .I know full well that this country is full of immigrants from all over the world .I do not have a problem with immigrants .I have a huge freaking problem with ILLEGAL immigrants.Heck, some of those people may not have even been vaccinated.Who knows ? We have no idea which of them is a murderer ,rapist , or worse .Some might even be preachers .But we have the right to know who is living here.Period.And once someone has avoided coming here the legal way we should NEVER reward that by letting them stay .So call me a racist but you and I both know that is not the real issue.I do not feel sorry for the first one of them.

[ckerr4]

lol, there are people on this board who don't get their children vaccinated. That's not the real issue either.

To me the real issue is why was it okay for so long for people to come here, and then once there was this nice population of white people, was it okay for all the white people to say, "now we're going to make laws restricting everyone else from coming over"? That's when all the laws started. The people already here didn't want Asian people, Southern European, Eastern European, African, Mexican people to come here.

Sure, it's political. It's also cultural. And yes, to a large extent, for many people, the underlying problems are racist. I think many people wouldn't even NOTICE if the immigrants (illegal or legal) were from England or Irealnd. But since they're from Mexico - oh no, those people are SO DIFFERENT! lmao.

[babymaniac]

Who said I am white ?http://www.americanpatrol.com/REFERENCE/isacrime.html

[JENNIFERCATLADY]

Just a few more thoughts... Why would any of us be expected to feel sympathy for felons .Illegal aliens have committed a felony .If Charles Manson makes a prison break tomorrow , is it acceptable for the government to give him free housing ,and food ,and an education ,and let him live tax free as well ? Of course not . Who would want an escaped felon roaming our streets???? Nobody. But that is exactly what we are expected to be ok with everyday .They should be collected and sent back .Period .The Country being on a code orange security alert is a joke.How are we safe when the government turns a blind eye to millions of illegals ?

I read the other day that a border patrol officer drown while chasing a bunch of Illegal Aliens. Yup, let's go find those illegal aliens and give them a nice big reward.

[JKATHERINE]

Well said, Jennifer.


I also want to say, what happens when we let all these "illegal immigrants" have legal status and they tell all their friends back home. Are the flood gates open then?

I don't care what race they are or where they're from. We do not need any more people in the U.S. We are overcrowded as it is! I love people of all races and this is the "land of the free" but what kind of life are we all to have if the entire country is eventually made up of houses and tenement buildings within a few feet of each other just to accomodate our ever-growing population? I value my space and I'll be damned if I work hard all my life to share my precious space with someone who doesn't belong here. JMO

[momfromTN]

Originally posted by *chelle*
Well i don't think what Clinton did was anyones business
in the first place other than his wifes - JMO

I personally don't give a rip who does him either, but he LIED under oath, which, again, if you or I did it, we would have done some jail time. That was my point.

[Mom2B&L]

Originally posted by JKATHERINE
Well said, Jennifer.


I also want to say, what happens when we let all these "illegal immigrants" have legal status and they tell all their friends back home. Are the flood gates open then?

I don't care what race they are or where they're from. We do not need any more people in the U.S. We are overcrowded as it is! I love people of all races and this is the "land of the free" but what kind of life are we all to have if the entire country is eventually made up of houses and tenement buildings within a few feet of each other just to accomodate our ever-growing population?

{I value my space and I'll be damned if I work hard all my life to share my precious space with someone who doesn't belong here.} JMO

The problem is...who decides which people get to stay and which people get to leave. Many illegal aliens leave their countries in search of a better place. Who are we to deny them the opportunities that were/are afforded us AND printed very clearly in our Constitution...supposedly the backbone of our country. Maybe we should just shred it and lets all go back to our home countries ?!?!?!

[JKATHERINE]

The people who are here LEGALLY get to stay, the ones here ILLEGALLY get the boot. Isn't this what this conversation's all about?

[Mom2B&L]

Yes, it is but the problem with that is our process of immigration takes an eternity and is very complicated. Many "illegal" aliens may not survive long enough to get through that process. Make them honest...pay their taxes, earn a living, and CONTRIBUTE like the rest of us. I say get rid of those with terrorist ties/backgrounds but let the others stay..it's obvious they aren't causing us severe economic damage right now, especially since they have been here for years already.