Texas school district to let teachers carry guns this fall...

Mini · 08-15-2008, 07:56 PM

HOUSTON (Reuters) - A Texas school district will let teachers bring guns to class this fall, the district's superintendent said on Friday, in what experts said appeared to be a first in the United States.

The board of the small rural Harrold Independent School District unanimously approved the plan and parents have not objected, said the district's superintendent, David Thweatt.

School experts backed Thweatt's claim that Harrold, a system of about 110 students 150 miles northwest of Fort Worth, may be the first to let teachers bring guns to the classroom.

Thweatt said it is a matter of safety.

"We have a lock-down situation, we have cameras, but the question we had to answer is, 'What if somebody gets in? What are we going to do?" he said. "It's just common sense."

Teachers who wish to bring guns will have to be certified to carry a concealed handgun in Texas and get crisis training and permission from school officials, he said.

Recent school shootings in the United States have prompted some calls for school officials to allow students and teachers to carry legally concealed weapons into classrooms.

The U.S. Congress once barred guns at schools nationwide, but the U.S. Supreme Court struck the law down, although state and local communities could adopt their own laws. Texas bars guns at schools without the school's permission.

freeby4me · 08-15-2008, 07:59 PM

Interesting. I would be willing to bet it will deter kids from even thinking its possible to do something now.

Jolie Rouge · 08-15-2008, 08:39 PM

There are some schools here that I would not go into unless I were armed.

Reminds me of a line from "Miss Congeniality" with Sandra Bullock :
"This is Texas, everyone has a gun, heck, my florist has a gun !"

jbbarn · 08-16-2008, 12:37 AM

Awesome! That should deter some otherwise unruly punks.

Jolie Rouge · 08-19-2008, 01:56 PM

Union Prez: Teachers 'Don't Have it in Them' to Shoot Columbine-like Killers
By Mark Finkelstein
August 19, 2008 - 08:32 ET

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/mark-fi...ombine-killers

If your child's school were invaded by Columbine-style killers, methodically murdering students in cold blood, would you want teachers to shoot to stop them? Gayle Fallon wouldn't. For that matter, Fallon doesn't think teachers "have it in them" to even try to save their students' lives. Fallon, the president of a teachers union in Houston, TX, made her views known during an Early Show segment this morning conducted by Harry Smith.

The topic was a decision adopted by a rural north Texas school district to permit teachers to carry guns in the classroom. Harrold, TX School Superintendent David Thweatt explained that the decision was prompted by the school's close proximity to an interstate and its remoteness—thirty minutes away from law enforcement—factors presumably making it a tempting target. Thweatt made clear that all guns have to be approved by the school board and teachers have to undergo extensive safety and related training. None of that mattered to Fallon.

Quote:

HARRY SMITH: Gayle, when you first heard about this, what was your reaction?

GAYLE FALLON: Initially I thought it was a joke. However, after a couple of media calls, we realized it wasn't and we were asked whether our district would consider it, and it was absolutely no way would we consider it. One of the things that hit me is, you know, Columbine and the other incidents were generally initiated by students. Now, I've been around teachers a long time. They don't have it in them to aim at a student and kill him. They'll freeze. Nor would I want them to.

When a young person takes up arms and starts murdering people, he ceases being a "student" and becomes a killer. For a teachers union prez, Fallon certainly has a low opinion of her colleagues, to think they'd be incapable of acting to save innocent life. As for her notion that mass school murders "were generally initiated by students": so what? If Fallon is right and teachers would freeze in such situations, no harm done beyond that resulting from inaction. But what of cases like that of the Amish school shooting of 2006 in which an armed man murdered five girls aged 6-13? Not to mention the possibility of terrorist incidents, such as the Beslan massacre, in which 334 hostages were ultimately killed.

Smith conducted the segment in reasonably balanced fashion, even suggesting that the rule might have a deterrent effect. But at one point he stated "when looking at this, and I want to be as serious as possible." The inference is that Smith's instinctive reaction, one that he worked to overcome, was to treat the district's decision like Fallon did: as a joke.

MRC News Analyst Kyle Drennen provided a full transcript of the segment:

7:01AM TEASER:

Quote:

HARRY SMITH: Plus, a controversial decision by a Texas school district. It has decided to allow teachers to carry guns into the classroom. Will this prevent violence? We'll have a debate, coming up.

7:13AM TEASER:

Quote:

JULIE CHEN: Also, teachers carrying guns into the classroom. Will it prevent the next Columbine or Virginia Tech. The superintendent in Texas thinks so. We'll talk to him.

7:30AM TEASER:

Quote:

SMITH: Still ahead this morning, a school district in Texas is the first in the nation to let teachers carry guns. We're going to have a debate with the school superintendent and the president of the Houston Federation of Teachers.

7:33AM SEGMENT:

Quote:

HARRY SMITH: A rural Texas school district has made a decision that appears to be the first of its kind in the country. Teachers are now permitted to carry guns. Harrold, Texas is located near the border with Oklahoma. Joining us is the District Superintendent, David Thweatt, and Gayle Fallon, President of Houston Federation of Teachers is also with us this morning. Good morning to you both.

[GRAPHIC ON SCREEN: School Safety Gone Too Far? Texas District Allows Teachers to Carry Guns In School.]

GAYLE FALLON: Good morning.

DAVID THWEATT: Good morning, Harry.

SMITH: Mr. Thweatt, let me start with you. What made you decide to try and get this passed through your school board and why did you think this was a good idea?

DAVID THWEATT: Well Harry, we're looking at all the issues surrounding school violence, anything, starting with Columbine all the way up to the Pennsylvania shootings. And we started looking at state-of-the-art security, which we installed. And then we found that that was not good enough because we had a problem with being next to a 287 road north of us. And we're right 500 miles -- 500 feet off of that particular road. And then on top of that, we're about 30 minutes from law enforcement. And we started asking hard questions. What's going to happen when we get an active shooter into our school? And that's the reason we decided to go in this direction.

SMITH: Let me ask you this, are the weapons of the teachers, are they concealed, are they holstered? How -- how are they carried in the school?

THWEATT: Yeah, there are several components of this. They are concealed. They do have to be approved by our school board. And then they have to undergo extensive safety training and other training in hostage situations, et cetera, before we've installed this.

SMITH: Okay. Alright, Gayle, when you heard about this, what was your reaction?

FALLON: Initially, I thought it was a joke. However, after a couple of media calls we realized that it wasn't and we were asked would our district consider it. And it was absolutely no way would we consider it. One of the things that hit me is, you know, Columbine and the other incidents were generally initiated by students. Now, I've been around teachers a long time. They don't have it in them to aim at a student and kill them. They'll freeze.

SMITH: And-

FALLON: And nor would I want them to.

SMITH: Right. Mr. Thweatt, I guess when looking at this, and I want to be as serious as possible, what kinds of scenario are you imagining that your teachers might be called into actually using these arms, or do you just think perhaps folks knowing that they have arms in the school may be a preventive measure in and of itself?

THWEATT: I think it would, Harry. And because any time we've looked at these school shootings they've occurred after we've designated schools across the nation as gun-free zones. The people who are going into these situations are evil. I'm not going to be politically correct on this. I don't care what their problems were. They've gone in and killed children. And if they come into our school, they are going to meet resistance. And I think if we did have some resistance in our schools, these crackpots or whoever they are would stop going into them.

SMITH: Alright, Miss. Fallon, real quickly. Just, if someone -- if you woke up tomorrow and found out that Houston were going to allow teachers to carry guns in the schools, what would you do?

FALLON: We would elect a new school board immediately. I think what's going to happen, there is a loophole in the law that's allowed this. But our legislature meets in January. And the legislators I've talked with said they're going to plugging that loophole.

SMITH: Alright, we got to go for now. David Theatt, Gayle Fallon, thanks very much for your time this morning. Do appreciate it.

THWEATT: Thanks, Harry.

SMITH: You bet.

Jolie Rouge · 08-19-2008, 02:09 PM

Quote:

One of the things that hit me is, you know, Columbine and the other incidents were generally initiated by students. Now, I've been around teachers a long time. They don't have it in them to aim at a student and kill them. They'll freeze.

Any teacher responsible enough and serious enough to make the very serious decision to have a gun in school....well I would trust that person to be serious enough and courageous enough to use it responsibly in a Columbine-type emergency.

Ms. Fallon is implying that one has to have a "killer instinct" in order to act bravely and take a life to save many lives. Her statement that "nor would I want them to" is just outright irresponsible. She would rather see a 'student' kill 20 or 30 people than have a teacher stop him?

Not just irresponsible; it's outrageous.

This woman is basically saying that either teachers aren't brave enough to protect our children or they don't care enough to intervene. If I was a teacher I'd be ticked off that this woman is chosen to represent me.

If we place the response time to around 20 minutes after the initial shooting (it would take a little time for the school to realize what was going on, call the cops, explain, and the cops to get there.) I can easily fire 200 rounds in that time, 5 minutes a class, 4 classrooms with 25 students each (shoot the teacher first), that is 100. Then the cops get there, assess the situation, and decide if they want to go in (they do not have to, you know, if they feel it is too dangerous they can just wait till it is over, they and their jobs are protected by law in those instances, they never have to protect you) so, now I have another 10 minutes, that is 50 more people.

People do not realize how easy it is to do.

My children attended a school that left all of their doors unlocked up until 2006 when the lady's ex from across the street threated to kill her kindergartener. I asked why the doors were locked and a teacher told me (she was not supposed to tell me and was later admonished). My kid's class was next door to that kindergartener and they were not going to tell me to let me decide if it was safe for my son!!!! I asked to see their policy on violent threats to the school. They were so proud of it, it was a great policy (

) They turn off the lights in the classrooms, lock the glass doors, and all the kids are supposed to sit as quiet as possible so the invader does not know they are there. They then also lock all of the exterior doors ( so if the intruder is INSIDE no one can get OUT not can the First Responders get IN .... talk about closing the barn door )

After calling in a few favors at my former employer's ... the plan was adjusted.... still not much better ... but at least they don't lock the doors AFTER the threat. Now all doors lock automaticly when closed and the front lobby doors are on a click lock.

janelle · 08-20-2008, 12:56 AM

Well I would think the teachers would get some training when they get the gun. Some wouldn't be able to hit the side of a barn. Then also train them when to use them and what to look for.

Anyone going into a school with a gun to kill would think twice just knowing there are others in there with guns.

julie604 · 08-20-2008, 01:08 PM

Let's just hope that one of the teachers doesn't leave it where a kid can get ahold of it.

PrincessArky · 08-20-2008, 01:43 PM

The school has 110 students I wonder how many problems they have had with the students in the past

janelle · 08-20-2008, 03:47 PM

We had security officers at some schools here when we had all the racial tension in the 60s. It may need to go back to a security guard assigned to each school to be there everyday, all day. To me that makes more sense. Then a system for teachers to ring a buzzer to call for help.

freeby4me · 08-20-2008, 03:53 PM

See, if more than one teacher carries a gun, then even if a student were to "jump a teacher" and get the gun, there would be X number of teachers more with guns. A student can just as easily jump a security guard, then who else has a gun?

In this world where so many things could happen, I can think of alot worse stuff than teachers carrying guns.

08-15-2008, 07:56 PM	#1 (permalink)
Mini Go UT!!!! Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,163 iTrader: (9) Thanks: 1,394 Thanked 1,418 Times in 339 Posts	Texas school district to let teachers carry guns this fall... HOUSTON (Reuters) - A Texas school district will let teachers bring guns to class this fall, the district's superintendent said on Friday, in what experts said appeared to be a first in the United States. The board of the small rural Harrold Independent School District unanimously approved the plan and parents have not objected, said the district's superintendent, David Thweatt. School experts backed Thweatt's claim that Harrold, a system of about 110 students 150 miles northwest of Fort Worth, may be the first to let teachers bring guns to the classroom. Thweatt said it is a matter of safety. "We have a lock-down situation, we have cameras, but the question we had to answer is, 'What if somebody gets in? What are we going to do?" he said. "It's just common sense." Teachers who wish to bring guns will have to be certified to carry a concealed handgun in Texas and get crisis training and permission from school officials, he said. Recent school shootings in the United States have prompted some calls for school officials to allow students and teachers to carry legally concealed weapons into classrooms. The U.S. Congress once barred guns at schools nationwide, but the U.S. Supreme Court struck the law down, although state and local communities could adopt their own laws. Texas bars guns at schools without the school's permission. __________________ To see the future you must forget your past...otherwise your past will become your future

08-15-2008, 07:59 PM	#2 (permalink)
freeby4me No, I just dont like you Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 10,039 iTrader: (23) Thanks: 515 Thanked 765 Times in 387 Posts	Interesting. I would be willing to bet it will deter kids from even thinking its possible to do something now. __________________ Dont cry because its over. Smile because it happened.

08-15-2008, 08:39 PM	#3 (permalink)
Jolie Rouge C & P Queen Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Missin' Mesue ... Posts: 33,944 iTrader: (2) Thanks: 732 Thanked 1,398 Times in 759 Posts	There are some schools here that I would not go into unless I were armed. Reminds me of a line from "Miss Congeniality" with Sandra Bullock : "This is Texas, everyone has a gun, heck, my florist has a gun !" __________________ Laissez les bon temps rouler! Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car. a 4 day work week & sex slaves ~ I say Tyt for PRESIDENT!** Not to be taken internally, literally or seriously ....Suki ebaynni IS THAT BETTER ?

08-16-2008, 12:37 AM	#4 (permalink)
jbbarn TRUE MAS*HOLE!!!!!! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: UNFORTUNATELY NOT IN MASSACHUSETTS! Posts: 1,519 iTrader: (0) Thanks: 2,918 Thanked 760 Times in 427 Posts	Awesome! That should deter some otherwise unruly punks. __________________ Secure our borders;send 'em home! INFRACTED (?)

08-20-2008, 01:43 PM	#9 (permalink)
PrincessArky Have a great day Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: At this point just trying to win anything again lol Posts: 21,850 iTrader: (11) Thanks: 842 Thanked 744 Times in 521 Posts	The school has 110 students I wonder how many problems they have had with the students in the past __________________ Ya can't hide redneck might as well be proud-Tracy Lawrence

08-20-2008, 12:56 AM	#7 (permalink)
janelle Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Posts: 20,403 iTrader: (1) Thanks: 451 Thanked 1,144 Times in 744 Posts	Well I would think the teachers would get some training when they get the gun. Some wouldn't be able to hit the side of a barn. Then also train them when to use them and what to look for. Anyone going into a school with a gun to kill would think twice just knowing there are others in there with guns.

08-20-2008, 01:08 PM	#8 (permalink)
julie604 Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 694 iTrader: (0) Thanks: 42 Thanked 25 Times in 17 Posts	Let's just hope that one of the teachers doesn't leave it where a kid can get ahold of it.

08-20-2008, 03:47 PM	#10 (permalink)
janelle Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Posts: 20,403 iTrader: (1) Thanks: 451 Thanked 1,144 Times in 744 Posts	We had security officers at some schools here when we had all the racial tension in the 60s. It may need to go back to a security guard assigned to each school to be there everyday, all day. To me that makes more sense. Then a system for teachers to ring a buzzer to call for help.

08-20-2008, 03:53 PM	#11 (permalink)
freeby4me No, I just dont like you Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 10,039 iTrader: (23) Thanks: 515 Thanked 765 Times in 387 Posts	See, if more than one teacher carries a gun, then even if a student were to "jump a teacher" and get the gun, there would be X number of teachers more with guns. A student can just as easily jump a security guard, then who else has a gun? In this world where so many things could happen, I can think of alot worse stuff than teachers carrying guns. __________________ Dont cry because its over. Smile because it happened.

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